Lakota Home City Cards - Again, but for new cards

Lakota Cards

I did a go-through like this last year that seems to have made some fairly significant changes in the game. However, I don’t think theymade enough changes and too many things were glossed over or completely ignored.

Given the improvements that were attempted with the new card rework, it feels like it’s time to do this again.

Tribal Leader

Starting off, the “Tribal Leader” would have been… the Elder. That would have been the best pick for this position. Tribes were led by a council, which would have had the most respected Unci (Grandmother) of the constituent tiospayes present as its leader. Could just rename this “Grandmother” and it’d work better.
Just a thought.

Healers

  • Rename them to something more interesting. After thinking about it, calling them Medicine Men/Women would be more accurate. They occupy a similar role that a Christian Priest or a Muslim Imam holds, and neither of those are known as healers despite being given the role in the game. I’d suggest the name Phezuta Winyan, or “Medicine Woman” and making them a female unit. It’d be more accurate - among the Medicine Men and Women, the women were more often known as healers.
  • I am still of the opinion that the Healers should have an Advanced Phezuta card that increases their healing to the level of that of a Surgeon and allows them to build little medicinal huts that serve the same function as a Field Hospital. Call it the Medicine Lodge.

Ogle Tanka Un

  • For those unaware, this refers to the Lakota practice of using a specific shirt to establish someone as a leader. However, I laugh when I see “Ogle Tanka Un”. Rather than using the actual word for the person who wears the shirt - Wakichunza - they chose to translate “Wears Big Shirt” literally. I don’t know why. It’s amusing. It reads less like “Leader” and more like someone who presumptuously named themselves “President”.
  • Other than that, it’s a good reference. I might just ask that they rename the card to the proper name.
  • Wakichunza means “Decider”.

Heyoka

  • Like the reference. Do not like that the art they chose to depict the Heyoka is not a Heyoka at all, but rather a Pueblo Clown. It is likely they made a generic google search for “Heyoka” and went with the first results they found that had interesting and notable characteristics - However, I have pointed out on several occasions that Lakota Heyoka were known for doing things backwards.

Blotahunka

  • Love it. The art is funny.

Morning Star

  • Never understood this reference. Anpao is the morning star and the spirit of twilight, next to her sister, Han, the spirit of the dark. But what do either of them have to do with the results of this card?
  • Rename to “Prayers of the Dragonfly”. Dragonflies are known as the spirits of fallen warriors and are sacred to Wi, the Sun Chief. Praying on a dragonfly wouldn’t have been seen as unusual, and asking for wisdom from these fallen warriors would have been in line with the culture.
  • Rename to “Sunbeams”. Wi is the Sun Chief and the spirit of light and change. Referencing him in a pre-battle prayer would have made more sense.

What do Conestoga Wagons have to do with the Lakota?

Warrior

This one could be the Warchief, or the Akicita. Either or, same concept.

Territorial Claims

  • The effects of this card make sense. The name? Not so much. Rename to Osage Groves, in reference to our favourite wood to make bows and clubs with. Would make more sense.
  • We didn’t do our hair like that. That’s a Haudenosaunee hairstyle. Our hair is sacred - we only cut it down when in mourning, and certainly not in battle. Very much a Samson and Delilah complex going on.

Moccasins

  • Uh. Why do we have a card named… “Shoes.” Great. We wore shoes. Good job, devs, you turned a basic piece of clothing into a whole card… somehow.

Seven Council Fires

  • There’s firmly one Council Fire being represented here, and it’s the Lakota. There’s no Dakota or Dakhota units in the game to speak of. Maybe change the name to Seven Oyate, after the seven Lakota tribes.

Akichita

  • The spelling will forever confuse me - “Akicita” is how we spell it most of the time, and how it gets spelled in most of our names.
  • I unironically like the effects of this card - the Akicita are for the people. Reminding them of who they are should make them less willing and effective against non-combatants.

Leman Trade Muskets

  • Rifle Riders don’t use muskets, and the Leman Trade Rifle wasn’t a musket. Leman Trade Rifles.

Advanced Captured Mortars

  • I hate this card and the purely fictional “Captured Mortar” with a vengeance. Rather than try and approach the problem the devs created for themselves, they decided to just give the Native civs a European unit and call it a day. I have a lot more thoughts on this card than I can list here, but there will be a whole section on the mortar and what I think needs to replace it further down. Remove. For the love of all that is Wakhan, remove this god-forsaken card and unit from the game.

Marauders

  • My thoughts on the previous topic - the Captured Howitzer - ties into this. TLDR:
  • Rename to “Cliff Raiders” and retain the tech, but why will become more clear when I explain the replacement to the We Were Too Lazy To Research Howitzer.

TEAM Mustangs

  • Why is this a team card now? It was barely enough before it got nerfed, but now it’s just kinda worthless. Make it a non-team card again.

Onikare

  • I still don’t like this card. I know Onikare isn’t a Lakota word - the Lakota term for this Inipi.
  • How do I know this isn’t a Lakota word? We don’t have the letter R in our language.

TEAM Bare Lances

  • How would you feel if the Ottomans had a card called TEAM Minutemen but it sent Sipahis instead? Because that’s the equivalent of what calling this “Bare Lances” is implying. The Bare Lances were untested, green, novice warriors with no experience in battle. Why is this card sending the most elite of the Oglala Akicita? Weird upgrade.

TEAM War Badgers

  • Imagine you have a card called TEAM War Wagons but it sends Winged Hussars instead. You’re not gonna be annoyed, but like… you’re definitely gonna be confused. The Warpath Badgers are their own Akicita, so why are they sending Kitfox Soldiers? Lateral.
  • Also, it’s Warpath Badgers, not War Badgers. They were known as the Zuya Hoka, not the Okichize Hoka. Zuya means “To be on the path for war,” while Okichize is “Battle”. They are “The Badgers on the path to war”.

Elder

Name is weird. “Silent Eater’s Lodge” might be a better name. The Silent Eaters are the Akicita comprised of elderly men and women well past their fighting days.

Black Arrow

  • Someone noted that this reference is likely Cheyenne. I don’t doubt it. Might I suggest Red Road Messengers? The Red Racetrack was a notable trade route to move quickly around the Black Hills, and specifically in-between the Lakota and our Cheyenne and Arapaho allies.

New Ways

  • Rename to Western Ways.

Nomadic Expansion

  • Bizarre name. I think the focus on using Tipis in a militaristic manner is just weird, when you consider the philosophy of the culture behind the tipi - Would you use Islamic Mosques as a military building to boost your military units on the battlefield? Because the tipi itself is the closest thing we have to a religious building, and yes, it is where we lived as well. That is not an accident.

Friendly Territory

  • Name is better, but see above. Function is still just bizarre.

TEAM Great Lakes

  • Would you give France a card called “TEAM Black Sea”?
  • I’ve got thoughts involving the Haida, the Lakota, and the Haudenosaunee for thoughts at a later point.

Ranching

  • Just remove it.

Camp Movements

  • Fun, but this feels like it should be foundational to the civ. Maybe make the effect foundational to the civ, but at a cost and take time, then have this card remove the cost and heavily cut down the cost?

Winter Counts

  • It’s not lost on me that the new cards shoved a lot of XP bonus methods into the Lakota because the devs didn’t want to rework the economy of the civ to make sense, so they just gave the Lakota an infinite bison shipment and said “f*ck it” instead of finding an actual solution that isn’t lazier than me on a Sunday afternoon. Conceptually, I like what this card does. Realistically, I hate that it only exists because the devs don’t want to actually fix the problems of the civ and insist that “Another layer of bandaids will fix it this time, I promise!”

Wise Woman

Phezuta Winyan. Just call her the Phezuta Winyan. See above.

Great Hunter

  • Card is mildly interesting. Mildly.

Earth Bounty

  • Again, rename to Grandmother’s Gifts.

Adoption

-Again, I hate this name. Adoption has been problematic on the Reservation since their inception, to the point where you could literally buy a Native kid for a few cents and have them shipped to you as your own personal slave because they weren’t a citizen and couldn’t be protected by the state or laws the same way a white kid could be. Rename it to nearly anything else, this name is just blindly ignorant and mannerless.

  • Rename to Naming Ceremony.
  • Again, another card shoved into here with a massive XP boost because the devs were too lazy to fix the problems with the Lakota and just shoved an infinite bison shipment onto the civ instead.

Fur Trade

  • I have nothing to say on this, just want to point out that this card is absolutely disgusting on a good Lakota player in treaty.

North America Trade

  • This is from my mod I made a year or so ago. I still think that my solution was significantly better for gold generation - While Villagers hunt, they trickle 0.15 coin/sec, and the rate is tripled to 0.45/sec if they hunt within X radius of a Tipi, which I had, at the time, made auto-gather from mines.
  • On thinking about it now, I’d triple the trickle if gathering within X units of a Trade House and give them a fun revolution to become a Spaghetti Western spoof here.

I’m going to take this moment to talk specifically about the We Were Too Lazy To Think Creatively Howitzer and the changes I mentioned about the Tashunke Prowler, as a way to split the long summary up a bit.

Lakota Siege

The Lakota have a siege issue. They lack the range of other nations to siege from afar and break through defenses in a notable manner. That is undeniable.

However, while most people are trying to find a full solution to this, I say this - This is good for the civ. This is a civ that is 80% Cavalry units, which are inherently durable into artillery and even fairly durable into their own counters due to naturally high health pools on many of the units and lack of ranged anti-cavalry units with AoE. Let the Lakota lean heavier into the fact that they do have the speed and durability to run up to a wall and siege it to bring it down rather than needing to fight from afar in a war of attrition. This is civ diversity and brings new strategies into the game, which are sorely missing after the repeated nerfs this civ has gotten to its cavalry, in some bizarre and ill-founded attempt to make the infantry the main units of the civ.

Remove the siege boost from the Warclub, just make it naturally a little higher, and make the Cetan Bowman fire at full range naturally for its siege attack. That will be more than enough for any ranged siege the Lakota need, and then the Territorial Claims/Osage Groves card can be used to increase the range of the Cetan Bowman from 16 to 20, and the Arson Prowler can get its siege range bumped from 6 to 10.

Arson Prowlers

I propose, again, the Itkunyan Prowler. Lower the base siege of the Lakota cavalry across the board, remove the build limit and pack bonus from the Tashunke Prowler, then give it a grenadier attack against buildings and a melee AoE attack like it currently has. Give it a large shield and high ranged resistance. This will give the Lakota a dedicated siege unit that is effective, fast, and durable, but without being highly effective into units - the torches it throws would be very effective against buildings, but worthless against units, which is why it would have only a melee AoE against units, and not a good one.

And please, for the love of all that is holy, get rid of the We Didn’t Want To Think Critically Howitzer.

Back to the cards.


Messenger

This one is long. The Messenger cards have way too many problems - From shipping in some of our worst enemies to getting aid from ourselves twice, these cards are just a wild mess with absolutely no effort put into them. Rather than going through each card individually, I’m going to go through in separate chunks.

Chunk 1 - The Seven Oyate

The “Support” class cards are split into two - the Seven Oyate support cards and then the support cards from… completely random people. Why are the Nakoda helping us? They neither like us nor dislike us.

The Seven Oyate should be as follows:

  1. Hunkpapa Support
    • Leaders of the Lakota. Should be the most powerful card. Main Character Energy.
  2. Oglala Support
    • Tokala come from the Oglala. The Big Guy/Muscle/Toph Beifong to the Hunkpapa’s Main Character.
  3. Sicangu Support
    • Itkunyan Prowlers are based on the Sicangu. The Lancer to the Hunkpapa’s Main Character.
  4. Oohenunpa Support
    • Successor to the Hunkpapa and noted as the most generous of the Lakota - their name comes from “If they had two kettles left, they would give you one anyway.”
  5. Itazipcho Support
    • “Without Bows”. I made this a funny upgrade for all non-archer units in the civ.
  6. Siha Sapa Support
    • The Black Foot were known as the wealthiest of the Lakota tribes, and often avoided getting involved with the wars of the Hunkpapa, Oglala, and Sicangu, who are noted as the troublemakers. We Oglala are stilled called “the Wild Oglala” because of this.
  7. Mniconjou Support
    • Someone tried to plant on the Missouri. It failed. They got named for it. Everyone was weirded out.

Chunk 2 - The Other Support Cards

Throwing in the various “Ally” cards as well, these cards currently comprise of: the Cheyenne, the Comanche, the Cree, the Nakoda, the Dakota, and the Dakhota. Of these six nations, two would have never helped us, and probably would have run us over if were begging on the street - the Cree and Comanche were the biggest rivals on the prairie, from the north and south. The Nakoda, by extension, were largely disliked by us because they were part of the Iron Confederacy under the leadership of the Cree. That’s three of the six given nations that getting allies from is nonsensical.

That leaves the Cheyenne, the Dakota, and the Dakhota.

The Cheyenne

  • These guys were the unofficial 8th Oyate of the Lakota nation. When you send a Cheyenne Dog Soldier shipment in, you should be enabling the ability to train and upgrade these guys for the remainder of the game. 3-6 cards is all that’s necessary - 1-2 for each age, depending on what age you’d like to send them in to use, and how many you’d like to ship in at a given moment. Include a shipment for Chief Roman Nose who has an aura that improves Native units.

The Dakota and Dakhota

  • Frankly, there are neither Dakota nor Dakhota units in the game, and they weren’t that great of allies at this point in history. Drop them. Exchange for…

The Arapaho!

  • Arapaho Cloud Sisters, a Mercenary type unit available in Age 3 that the Lakota can upgrade through these cards, along with a shipment for Chief Pretty Nose, who has an aura that improves mercenary units. I rather like the idea of the Cloud Sisters being a mercenary version of the American Carbine Cavalry.

Chunk Three - Mercenary Cards

Dropping the rest of the Support cards should leave enough room to ship in other Mercenary units. This would be a 3-4 shipments of Cloud Sisters, 2-3 shipments of Osage Giants, and potentially 2-3 shipments of Red Sticks and 2-3 shipments of Crazy Dogs.
(The Crow and Muskogee are pure mercs, and their relationship with the Lakota is ignored here. These are introducing potential Native mercenary units.)

Red Stick: Muskogee Mercenary armed with a long-range rifle and the ability to stealth. Fights with a club in melee, giving him an AoE melee attack. (Essentially the mercenary Forest Prowler.)
Crazy Dog: Crow woman armed with a lance, but with a melee bonus into other cavalry units. High health and a short range on her melee attacks, similar to the Meteor Hammer. (Essentially the mercenary Dog Soldier.)


Well this has been interesting

I post about the Lakota a lot. I know. But I want to see change, and the only way that’s going to happen is if I keep pressing the devs about the Lakota and the fact that they marketed this game using my culture as political brownie points while simultaneously refusing to make any actual change.

In short, remove the Plaza and put some work into remaking the Lakota and Hauds into actual civs that aren’t just stereotypes based on children’s books. This post doesn’t even delve into the economy rework I think the Lakota need, nor the full unit rehaul to include the actual Akicita of the culture, such as the Crow Owners, the Strong Hearts, or the White Marked. The Warpath Badgers in particular, I want to see.

And, if nothing else, at least rename the Warpath Badgers. They are not the War Badgers, they are the Warpath Badgers.

8 Likes

Nice post and good suggestions, this is highly unlikely to happen though as lakota remains a fairly unpopular civ like most of the natives so I don’t see them investing this much time into it.

It’s easy to conclude something is unpopular when you initially put zero effort into it and deliberately make it worse at its own defining traits.

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I don’t think that’s why it is unpopular, most people wouldn’t know in such detail the mistakes with the civ like you do. It’s a trend that pretty much all native civs are unpopular, the least played civs in the game are ethiopia, haud and hausa and closely followed by aztec and inca. Lakota is a tiny bit higher because after aztec there’s portugal and then lakota so at least it’s the most popular of all the native civs. European style civs are by far the most popular probably due to the popularity of artillery and musketeers and people don’t seem to like those with a lot of infantry like inca and aztec.

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The civ gimmicks make the civs more micro-intensive than they need to be. It’s why suggestions for the Lakota tend to lack any specific gimmick and instead focus on making the civ’s overall loop more challenging, yet simple.

ADD: Basically, Influence/Cow Market + the Plaza are meant to balance these civs to meet the same power level of the European civs. Makes sense on paper, but in practice, this means the two civs have significantly more micro required to play them to the same base level of a European civ. There’s no gain to playing well, there’s only meeting the same base floor as civs who don’t have these gimmicks.

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They have so many design issues over and above what is mentioned here.

I don’t think I’ll ever play as the North American natives until they revert the outhouse next to a mine back to normal mining. It’s just stupid tedium for no reason.

The Incas didn’t have a be an Aztec ripoff. They very quickly adopted cavalry and artillery and could easily be a relatively normal civ.

There are actual reasonable alternatives to long ranged siege other than giving the natives a European mortar smeared with mud.

The Plaza is just a stupider fire pit with no visual feedback. At least give the Aztecs and Incas a cool looking temple if not a full rework.

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I think it has more to do with the simplicity of their gameplay compared to other cultures.

Unfortunately, that’s how it is. If there was a “gain”, these civs would be OP in some players hands. In every game styles (rts, mobas, fighting, etc) there are easy-to-play civs / characters and some harder to play. This isn’t a bad thing in my opinion, as it adds diversity and makes the game accessible to everyone.

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And yet, it would not be hard to improve. It takes creative thinking and approaches, which the devs have done with the Euro civs recently. Why they refuse to use these skills to improve the other civs is beyond me.

I haven’t given up completely on lakota but the tribal market thing is still so annoying, despite making it free

Tribal market is basically mining camps from aoe2.

I sure hope they’ll take the time to update natives and asians. The new update is about euopeans, hopefully next one will focus either on natives or asians. They deserve the same treatment.

Very unlikely, this update was mostly about updating royal guard units to have unique visuals. All of the native units are unique anyway.

Yes, they’re unique but they’re innacurate or completely made up. They deserve better representation.

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The only two units in Tortuamerica that aren’t completely made up are the Tokala Soldier, which would be better named as the Kitfox Soldier, and the Cheyenne Rider, which would be better named as the Cheyenne Dog Men. Outside those two units, these units are completely made up.

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Thats the reason to people complaining about their ““OP”” units. They arent better, they have encounter a player who can hold their micro intensive gameplay.

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