This is gonna be a disaster and I hesitate to see the responses already. Angry enough already. Entitled AoE2 brats.
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See that confuses me⊠if you just want to be done with AoE3, why make not just the base game, but also 4 well-made and thought out DLCs?
And if youâve already made those DLCs, maybe theyâll sell if you let AoE3 be in RedBull.
All of this is so mean to AoE3 fans. Why sabotage the very little we have?
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Have you been designated as a spokesman of AoE 3 fans? 
Genuinely asking- do people care about tournaments. You know long term, competitive players are a fraction of overall player number. How many people care about it and view 3DE primarily through a prism of pro PvP action?
80%, 55%, 15%?
A lot of money has been burned on these for 2DE and IV and we can compare view numbers.
IMO that money is much better spent promoting new expansion on Steam and other places.
3DE never was and most likely wonât be in a position of rivalry with 2DE in that specific function. It can be, but game is not heading that direction, not with a dedication (well, âfocusâ) behind IV or all the mass gathered behind AoE II (DE), not with the nature of all that stuff that has been added into the game.
3DE is super fun, including various multiplayer modes, but never at any point I thought about it as a tournament juggernaut.
Obviously it deserves it much more than 1DE, especially now with few recent DLC and one releasing in a moment, but still, itâs not a stab in the back for the fans.
These events do not increase dedicated MP player numbers in any real way.
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For example, putting it into an event that âcelebrates the 25th anniversary of the SERIESâ. I cannot think of a better way to promote it.
Or what is the other they should promote it? Maybe put the advertisements on Times Square?
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To be fair, if Iâm reading the Red Bull Wololo announcement correctly, only the final match will be played at the event. So AoE isnât receiving a tournament of the same size as AoE2 or AoE4. Is it weird AoE3 isnât receiving a spot? Sure. But AoEâs inclusion feels like it was tacked on, while AoE2 (the most popular) and AoE4 (the most recent) are the main events.
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Red Bull Wololo is a tournament, primarily. They can call it whatever they want in PR language.
Posting photos of AoE-themed cookies on social media can be call âcelebrationâ.
No, pro PvP tournament is not the best way to burn marketing money. Unless Iâm missing few zeroes from viewer numbers.
As if the situation with IV (a new game!) isnât already a good example.
How all other games are promoted, maybe?
Frontpage of the Steam and paid articles and videos on the biggest YouTube channels are better ways to help people discover and get into this series.
Pro competitive play is something a small fraction of the player base is interested it. And there are already two competitors in the same series. That is a lot and can be confusing from anyone outside of AoE ecosystem.
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My apologies. I donât mean to assume Iâm a representative of all AoE3 fans.
I was just wondering how much negative publicity this will bring to AoE3.
âAoE3 so bad that all games went to RedBull, except AoE3â.
And any other game from big companies had these.
Such tournament is a great opportunity that is almost exclusive to the AOE series. Not many RTS have sponsored tournament nowadays. I see no point of letting it slip.
Age of Mythology isnât there and it doesnât even have a definitive edition, either.
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The weird thing is the only AoE3 I see promoted on steam is legacy, not DE.
Yet despite this according to steamdb AoE3DE is ascending with positive reviews on a daily basis. Again, all the more reason to promote it.
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AOM is more perceived as a âspin-offâ.
But sure. The treatment is very bad.
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Guys, Is quite hard to include 3 DE at the tournament
The balance is overall quite volatile for AOE 3 DE, and check ESO community, there are people that still think some civs are wayy too strong (Ethiopians, Incas, Hausa) and the new ones are very probably, so basically the top bans could be the newest ones, so basically if AOE 3 DE goes to Red Bull, it will be just OG civs.
Another thing, there are fewer pros here.
AoE 2 (DE) is relatively speaking huge and IV is very focused on that gameplay type, and still interest in tournaments was low for these games when you take into account the biggest games on the various streaming platforms.
And AoE3 whether we like it or not- less popular than Age of Kings and (still) IV.
Itâs just burning money so few pro players can be paid in an event watched primarily by AoE fans.
Nobody goes âhmm Iâm bored, letâs watch random pro players in a game overloaded with content I have zero clue aboutâ.
They should go hard into promoting new tycoon and diplomacy modes and gather all player groups that for example feel like they are left behind by IV or are intimidated by AoE2 gameplay.
Itâs a great opportunity to build something interesting using the strengths of 3DE. Chasing AoE2 fame in a format that doesnât really exist these days (for various reasons, some of them- good reason) is an uphill battle.
Should it be there- sure why not.
Will being there impact anything in the long run- nothing suggests it will.
Having a tournament didnât prevent IV from tanking hard. A brand new game. Much more simplistic and approachable.
AoE 3 DE is already struggling with general design and identity. From a game about colonization and dynamics between old and new worlds, to a very vague historical RTS encompassing the entire world for 400 years. From conquistadores to the industrial revolution and political happenings in 1870s, from US revolution to standalone US civilization.
We have a great skirmish mode with mediocre and aged AI.
We have pretty good historical missions that are maybe not developed and promoted enough.
We have score battle mode with one map scenario.
We have multiplayer that never took over its predecessor and despite all wonders in 3DE is showing technological debt (performance in larger games).
We have an advanced (for its age) and good looking RTS with very little singleplayer narrative content, that hasnât been expanded for many, many years.
Now we have new great modes focused on less aggro gameplay and more cooperation.
And all that should be crammed into competitive tournament? Itâs not the best way to spend money.
Itâs not only focused on too many things but also is competing with games that are more popular and have more attention (and most likely funding- IV?) paid by IP owner.
IV is mimicking 2DE in many aspects and itâs doing meh at best. 3DE should do its thing, maybe it deserves a different tournament.
I donât have all the answers, but I know serious, competitive PvP isnât a driving force in the genre for almost all strategy games that are popular right now.
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I would not say AOE2 now with 40 civs have better balancingâŠ
And AOE1DE I wonder if there is enough match data to assess balancing at all.
As for original AOE1, since the bonuses are quite wild, I do not think balancing is good either. There are matches where people only play Shang and only allow spamming chariot archers.
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AOE4 has its internal problems and problems with how it was handled. Not gonna lie.
But if youâre telling the truth and they are really planning for that (and I really hope so)âŠI should see far more promotion videos for the new DLC. Right now I donât feel anything special. Especially considering how brilliant their work is.
It does not seem to me like âletâs use the fundings for AOE2/4 in the tournaments and use a similar amount of fundings for AOE3 in promoting the new sp and coop contentsâ because I do not really feel the latter.
Well right now most civs in AOE 2 DE are in a good spot, but some are too weak (Burmese), ones with terrible design and too punishing bonuses (Sicilians, Cumans) or others that are simply too strong (Chinese, Mayans).
AOE 1 DE literally lacks any competitive scene right now to measure balance.
Pre DE AOE 1 ofc was too unbalanced, but idk.
There is a difference between being a competitive player and spectating competitive matches. In the first, there is a fraction of players, but both are very faithful.
A competitive match viewer can be a casual player, a competitive player, or someone who doesnât own the game yet. So itâs a good marketing promotion to teach the game to thousands of people.
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So none of you even read the article ?
AoE 1 is there because there is a big competitive scene in vietnam.
So games with a big enough pro scene and crowd are featured, age3 isnât because it lacks both.
(Also : Vietnamese players still mainly play on aoe1 original version. Organizating this tourney could convince a bunch of those players to buy DE)
Can be viewed by anyone of course, but they are not. You get more views per dollar in other places.
And people already going out of their way to turn up to watch a tournament are mostly already fans of the series, even if they are inactive or play installments not featured in the tournament.
Tournaments of this (small) size when it comes to reach are really not the best discoverability tools. They have positive effects of course, but these are not community-made events made by volunteers. Thatâs a lot of money that wonât change the nature of RTS popularity in general.
Iâd love to see a big poll made by Red Bull where people can say if they were familiar with the brand before tuning in, or not.
People on official game forums are already a small fraction of the player base. The player base of AoE games is just a fraction of overall RTS genre. RTS games are a fairly small part os strategy genre in general.
Letâs put things into perspective.
Tournament wonât fix concurrent daily player numbers, nor it wonât push sales in big numbers. People in Iâd say 99%, donât buy games with a dream of becoming a competitive multiplayer star in one day, nor to make a living out of it.
Itâs better to spend that money on a new campaign. Or complete AI rework.
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You already know that right�
One of the reasons why AOE1 DE was not welcomed is because it feels too different from the original. The players stick to original AOE1 for decades and are so used to how it feels. I wonder if they would ever think of switching to DE.
If they can invest into salvaging AOE1 I see no problem with AOE3 as well.