Let's talk about Wonders re: patch 11009

In team games, Wonder victories are much more common, especially the 4v4’s. I’d love to know the data on just how often they are the winning factor.

With this siege nurf, 15mins timer on a wonder now seems far to short, when trying to get siege to react to the wonder, then getting it across the map, while keeping it safe, penetrating the bases defenses, and then taking out the wonder…

Is 4v4 now going to be a Wonder Race everygame, knowing siege is going to have a hard time dealing with it?


In closed map games its already become age of wonders, 3 rush while HRE fast imps in 12 mins then gets the wonder up in 15-16mins and walls / drops 10 castles it was already almost impossible to get to the wonder in time, now with slower and weaker siege its going to be impossible to take out a wonder in a team game.

Wonders need to be increased to 5000 or 6000 resources in team games, it should scale up 2v2 3v3 and 4v4 all incrementally increase the cost of a wonder, and the time needs to be 20mins.

The amount of games where 1 team wins by 30 seconds or 1 min because they have a million walls up or hidden their last landmark but losing team has completely whiped their base… it is ruining the game.


You may not agree with me, but I think that in competitive games, the distance of team maps should be smaller (if you want to play huge maps, custom games would be your thing).


Agree the distance on 3v3 and 4v4 is way to big.


Are you talking about miracles? I think it’s easier to just destroy the abbasid civilization than to destroy his miracles,

II agree, 4v4 map size is too big

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Wonder dont belong in team games. Case closed. Should be just reworked to give something extra for the player but not just auto win game

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Wonders do belong in team games, there needs to be an end game. Its a great mechanic to keep games within the 20-45 min time range that is the sweet spot for an rts.

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I do agree with this they are too big…

Keep the resources the same but the distance is just ridiculous, if you dont have cav you really can’t move your army to another part of the map to help in alot of maps that are divided.

the issue is, its a wonder race as soon as that new patch comes in, as it’s much easier to defend than push, especially now siege is slow af. i agree they belong in the game, which is why the suggestion of longer wonder time maybe? or more expensive?

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needs to be both 20mins and also scale with the amount of players… so at east 5000 resources 3k is nothing… that’s why ppl getting a wonder up 16mins into the game…

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Let’s wait for this Wonderful patch :wink: We are going to have a month of wonders and stone walls and who knows what is going to change after that.
I wonder if mongols siege workshop speed will be faster than bombards. This can be a solution…


I AGREE SO MUCH! 4v4 should really be medium map sizes, I love the 2v2 small map size, and the 3v3 should be 4v4 map size as well.
Smaller map size fixes alot with wonder victories. (looking at you black forest)

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Completely agree , 15 minutes is really short , the time should be set at 20 minutes . But wonders should have a bit more of health .

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I will be honest guys, Ive played over 400 games and I saw maybe a handful of games ending with a wonder victory. It just doesn’t happen much in higher ELOs, ive only seen “attempts”.
Addressing the problem in lower ELOs I think the more players are in the game the more wonder should cost. So for a 2v2 increase the cost by +1000 of each resource, +2000 for 3v3, +3000 4v4.

Make it + 2250 per player. Why? Easy: 30% trade tax.
So for one player its 3000
For two players its 5250 (3000 ressouces from one player, + [2250+30%Tradetax(750)]=3000 Ressources from the other player.

And so on. If you want to pool ressources it will cost 3000 per player this way.


I love it when someone HAS to shoehorn their elo into a discussion XD

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Yeah sorry for the cringe, but I didn’t meant to patronize. Just saying it is not a problem anymore after a point, which is something to consider as any balance change should be considered for ALL levels of play starting from top to bottom


Probably because its an extremely lame way to play the game and anyone who has a high elo is dedicated enough to not want to play the game like that.

Unfortunately in every closed map its litterally rush every game and HRE player sits back gets the wonder up by 16mins and then puts walls and 10 castles around it.

It was already almost impossible to take down, now theres zero chance you’ll be able to touch it with siege nerfed.

Yes another huge buff to Mongols… just what we needed for balance…