Let's talk CHINA

Eating the Goat =0.25settler eat Food Creato

I still have no idea what you are talking about?

is it that its not as much as a crate? cause the problem is that it allows china to age faster and gain much more tempo, so the amount is kinda irrelavent compared to just the age up time


I am like 0-13 vs China the past two days. The 1v1 ladder seems to be nothing but China.
If the devs nerf the asian civs the game balance will be half decent.


And Euro civs never got the Porcelein tower or the Tori gate, so whats the problem? Its civ specific, the entire idea of having unique civs. Because one civ or civ group have something doesnt mean every other one needs it too. The Asian civs are just not meant to go heavily into mercenaries, not to mention Euro civs barely use them either.

The only way I’ve found to beat them is go heavy eco in an attempt to get ahead of their unit curve.


It sounds like you don’t understand the situation. Asian civs and Euro civs alike were designed originally to have mercenaries available to them through 1 building and shipments. In the past these shipments were a one time thing, and mercenaries were mostly useful until Age IV.

One way to fix this was to give civs access to imperial mercenaries if they so choose, as well as making a lot of the Age IV merc shipments infinite. Despite coming from the same origin in terms of role, this was only implemented for European civs, making this an oversight to Asian mercs.

Your equivalence to Wonders is a false one, because Europeans never had access to them in the first place. It’s the difference between an addition, to an update.

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And Asians never had acces to imperial mercenaries in the first place.

Its an age up bonus, not an upgrade. If it was I would perhaps agree with you but its not. Asians have their age up bonusses, Euro civs have theirs.

the whole addition of imperial mercs is kinda terrible to begin with so lets keep that in mind


China, India, Lakota, Brits - in that order - are by far the most OP civs in the game. China and India are actually tied, no matter how much you outplay them a good player will still have a great eco and units to boot. They’ve been overclocked and need a small nerf, just like Brits got the -100f and made them from S+ to just S tier.

Change starting sheep food back down to 60f for starters.


so few people play india, much less play them well so they fly under the radar


So true. Every time I face a decent India player they easily both outboom me and outmass me at all stages of the game, if I dont play brits or something


Don’t forget Japan.
Ashi need speed nerf.


There are tons of Tweeks you could do to Japan however I don’t want them to lose all their uniqueness. Starting with the over the top teleporting double monks and make them actually move their vils a bit so they don’t have a early game that is unraidable and nearly 100% efficient is a good start.


China either rushes you strong or ff and get the ridiculous unit spam. If you rush them to try and prevent the FF they can just unit spam defend at home which is worse. To add insult to injury they often can FF anyway and it’s not a close match.

The only luck I’ve had is to eco boom and hope I don’t get rushed. If can get ahead a bit I can at least beat the lower players. I seldom if ever win at my level or above.


Nerf repelling volley and double faced armor would be good.
repelling volley: against light cav +0.5 not +1. Since the range resist of all most light cavalries has been reduced in de release.
double faced armor: +20% range resist not +35%. This shipment let iron flail and meteor hammer too tanky against range attack.


only euro dragoon and yabusame had range resist changes and that affects all skirms so I’m not sure how that is relavent to china only

their problem right now is that they are too consistent, a starting nerf is enough

Also Musket Rider 25%,Zamburak 20% and outlaws dragoon 20%. Only Ruyter and native survive. +1 against light cav is too strong now.

Ryuters only had 10 range resist so they cant really change that

its still something that is locked behind a card that is more often not even sent though, the problem is the mass itself and being able to have intervention + 10 skirms + 7 skirms from the wonder

Also something to be said about the greater unit selection limit making china’s huge mass also much more controllable and more formidable, something I suspected would happen

weakening that shipment doesnt do anything when china still have 50 + skirms coming to your face


China kinda has a few problems but I’ll lay out a few here from my experience.

  1. every production wonder is worth about 8 vills. by fortress age the classic summer palace, porcelain tower combo is about 16 of eco, and china trains vills while aging. you’re roughly 22 vills up over a classic spain ff.
  2. they can train units when almost popped. they can start a batch of 8 to 10 pop of units when at 49/50 population, making it very hard to keep a lid on china’s spam by sieging houses
  3. villages make raids almost entirely worthless in the majority of situations. this makes an even easier fortress ageup and makes it harder to punish a china player going greedy
  4. their unit shipments are all very high value. Civs like Haudenosaunee have shipments like 5 musket riders (750 res), while all of china’s are essentially perfectly fit to 1000 res (4 flails is an exception iirc). They also have wayy to many unit shipments available age 3.
  5. War academies allow training of infantry and cavalry together and make china able to react to any counter-push from a single building… for 200w.

*Proceeds to list a civ’s features