“Winning easy” are, usually, either related to using some OP strat (like Rus FC pre-patch or mongols spam) or just cheesing your opponent with some all-in strat (any HRE Meinwerk ram push in the house?). Cutting around trees is not winning easy.
First that you get to see your opponent doing that. Second, as you see him cutting, you see which units get through, so you can build an army that properly counter the opponent’s army.
It just wouldn’t be fair to expect that 30w investment would force the opponent to build a ram (10x more wood, plus tech) to get through that. This would make everything soooooo turtle leaning.
Please, just put some archers near your walls and kill the villagers. Yes, it adds more investment from you to properly defend yourself, but that’s exactly the point: It should never be too easy to do such a thing, as it’s not easy to attack someone, to balance your economy, to macro your production, to micro your units in battle, and so on. If things were easy, the game would get boring really fast.
You just need to put a few archers on the weak points of the walls. You will need units sooner or later anyways.
my native language is not english, better complain with google translate
Not even the professionals protect their villagers when they are attacked because it is complicated to be in 2 places at the same time despite the game’s alerts, the game does not alert you if a forest is cut down, by the time you find out, in 10 seconds it is already cut down. You guys just enjoy opposing other people’s ideas, I don’t know if you’ve ever given a worthwhile idea, and you insist on defending a disgusting trick, it’s a shame!
Bro, please be courteous! This is a place for discussion of ideas, and we actually think that cutting down trees to bypass walls is a valid method. We are even giving ideas for how to deal with that.
Back to the point, it’s not a dirty trick, and it’s not disgusting. It’s indended by design, i could bet. I honestly think this is beautiful, for an RTS: the constant innovations for dealing with problems in-game keep the game fresh and rewards the players who learn those things. Agressive players had the problems of walls, so they decided to cut trees. Now defensive players have problems with selective deforestation, so you gotta find a new solution. After that, agressive players will try to deal with the solution you end up using, and so on and so forth.
This is healthy gameplay and healthy meta-game development.
they can’t say “that has always been used in aoe”, the old system locked you in with buildings so that trick was useful, today the game has a different philosophy, so don’t compare it, and therefore in ao4 it’s no longer necessary, it just makes the stockade almost useless and everyone would play as mongols, in the end that would make the mongols stronger.
Well, I exposed all my points. I think they are pretty reasonable. And, to my eyes, your arguments are just trying to make this “cut around the wall” to stop, instead of looking at it as something that’s an actual healthy part of the game.
So I’m leaving this topic, for now at least.
I think my argument about mongols left you unanswered
The topic is about cutting trees around walls, and not mongols. I just kept the discussion on topic instead of allowing it to go anywhere else then the point
Seems legit to me
Trees can be cut down, can’t change this and I don’t want it to be changed. Just build walls around the trees, spend the extra 75 stone.
I agree!
Ppl act like there is nothing you can do about it when it’s as simple as leaving a small group of archers on stand ground formation near the weak point of the wall because they can shoot over the wall, and they will just shoot anything that pops in front of them.
If an opponent wants to rush me, sees I’m walled in, sends a viliager across the map, starts cutting trees, sneaks his army through and kills me, while I could see that all the time as my wall had vision, if give him a “ggwp”
Used that on black forest once I realized there are huge open chunks behind the trees. Cut a line => get my 2v2 m8 to put a stone wall in it to ■■■■ with enemys pathfinding, built towncenter + eco + landmarks behind it (he as well had 1 landmark), made a wonder there, enemys didn’t come through (and even if it was an easy chokepoint to hold)
Only worked once, but the time it worked it was awesome xD
But, as was explained in a post prior to yours, in AoE 2 the villager has to collect all the wood from the tree, making it massively more time consuming. Viable, yes, but a completely different level of how much time it takes between AoE 2 and 4. The OP is just proposing that AoE 4 should work the same as AoE 2, and I agree with their proposal. In the meantime, people should probably not use trees as part of their walls.
obviously, spending on palisades is less resources on the army and worse if it doesn’t work because of a villager, there are maps that force you to close against a forest, which makes it practically useless to use palisades then when saying that they will play as mongols it is because it will be scarce use of palisades. I see that both in the report and the bug they gave me their hearts but unfortunately there are more people in the forum who want the game as their aoe2, than people who surely already left the game because of disgusting tricks like that, it’s very few here, it’s a pain!
I agree with the solution. It is a very powerful trick.
I’ve used it for example used on Black Forest to create a hole in the side of the map where I put a wonder, with on a tiny gap that bombards could not fit through. Then I packed that area full of nest of bees and the enemy could not take the wonder.
We’ve also used it to get around walls on Black Forest and even on other maps like in OP’s screenshots. Really defeats the purpose of the walls.
In AOE2 this is actually not an issue afaik since you can only build over straggler trees - that is, trees that spawn away from other trees.
Let’s see it made where you can only pass through trees that have been fully collected and are now just stumps!
I’m glad you care more about game balance. And a worse consequence is that although it is possible to transit, it is not possible to rebuild the palisade.
In AoE2 you can just place a palisade over the tree to get rid of it. It only works on straggler trees, but for a map like Arena, it can be used to bypass the enemy walls.
it is obvious that they want the game as their aoe2, this is another game and it is no longer necessary