Make Manor deletable

Age of Empires III: DE III - Discussion
41

Making buildings deleteable is not because they have to be deleted.

The main purpose of making manors deleteable is to make them logical as buildings, allowing the player to delete them at any time for any personal reason just like any other building, not about the balance of British at all so the balancing advice is also not aimed to adjust the British economy. it’s just a companion scheme to make sure that the deletable manors don’t affect the current gameplay in any case.

I really can’t understand why someone would like such an illogical design about undeletable buildings when it’s certain that the economy and gameplay will not be affected.

42

game has been going just fine for 17 years

so many better things to occupy developers time.

2 Likes
43

I may seem totally against it, but I am not really I hope they find solutions to every little problem and do it in a way that enhances the game play and fun. There really is so much more to do though. I mean mahout pathing and other true balance things just need to be done first. Deleting houses could work but needs to be totally unabusable

peace

44

I’m up for manors being deletable if they kill the vill that they spawn (lol) or have a penalty of 135 w to delete them. Alternatively, you can just watch where you place the manors because you can still delete them when you lay the foundation, that is just before they are built.

1 Like
45

These things do not conflict with hotfixes.
Otherwise we won’t get any new cards, new units, new civs.

Yeah that’s why there is the balance suggestion.
It is welcome if there is a better way than a counter.

The third time.

Don’t be madly afraid of deletable manors. They are perfectly fine as long as they don’t get abused, such as with the balance suggestion. Even the wonders and factories are deletable. The manor can’t be deleted like a normal building is a really weird design.

46

Can say the same about banks but here’s the thing. You absolutely have no reason to delete them. Wonders and Factories are irreplaceable and Banks are a huge investment (700 resources for 4.6 vills). These buildings are often carefully placed to avoid something like deleting them in a more realistic scenario and manors are, well, basically just houses. Being able to spawn vills for just an additional 35w, however, is a really huge bonus. In layman’s terms, the resource/ability granted by Wonders, Factories or Banks dies with them if deleted, whereas vills spawned by the manors don’t die with them if deleted. So you have to be afraid and concerned of deletable manors. I know it’s a really weird design but this is the devs’ simple solution to prevent abuse and it has worked since 2005. I’m not against deletable manors, just that it’s not going to end up well or going to have a lot of work to be done.

2 Likes
47

Under the balance suggestion, if the player try to abuse the manor by repeating deleting and rebuilding, he/she still get UP TO 20 free settlers only as long as the manors do not be destroyed by opponents. The number of free settlers the player gets is totally same as he/she use manors in the current way but there is a pointless sacrifice of the population, which is not cost-effective.

Even the manor is deletable, your worries can still be prevented.
The balance suggestion fully guarantees the current gameplay and balance.

it’s called laziness and unwillingness to face the problem.
From my perspective as someone with programming experience, that’s a fairly small and simple balance work.

48

Okay, so you’re saying that manors should be deletable after getting 20 vills from them. And after which their function returns to a normal house? So they would cost extra 35 w and 10 extra seconds to build than a normal house. How is this design not weird?

49

Perhaps you have misunderstood this mechanic.
I don’t know if my English expresses my idea properly.

Manor can be deleted at any time by any personal reason at no cost, just like other buildings.
The difference is that rebuilding a manor that you delete cannot provide settlers.

It will be a counter there, starting at 20, meaning the default 20 free settlers will be spawned through the manors. As they are spawned from the manors by, the number will decrease until the number is 0 when the manor no longer spawns settlers. Ideally, it will be 0 when you exactly have all 20 manors.

Once your manor is destroyed by enemies, the counter will increment back, meaning your new manor is sure to a spawn new settler. For example, you built 8 manors, 5 destroyed by the enemy, and 3 remained. The counter will be 12+5=17, which means that the next 17 manors will spawn settlers, and you’ll get a total of 25 free settlers in this game.

The above performance is no different from the current gameplay.

The only difference is that once the manor is deleted by Yourself, this counter does Not Increase to prevent abuse. For example, you built 8 manors, 5 deleted by yourself, 1 destroyed by the enemy, and 2 remained. The counter will still be 12+1=13, which means that the next 13 manors will still be able to spawn settlers, but the 14th manor and beyond will not be able, and you will only get 21 free settlers in total. If the enemy hadn’t destroyed that 1 manor, so the counter will keep 12 and it would not be able to spawn settlers from the 13th, and there would still be only 20 free settlers in total.

Deletion is a self-determined action, not a forced situation like being destroyed. The previous manors have fulfilled the benefits, so even if the later estates can only provide population, it is the player’s own responsibility to bear the consequences.

50

No, I absolutely get what you’re saying and your English is very intelligible. The thing is manors are meant to provide you with a settler as a civ bonus upon being built, that’s why they are expensive and take some time to build when compared to normal houses. What you’re suggesting (going by the counter thing) turns them into normal houses without the bonus. So compared to normal houses basically, when you delete them, you donate 81 xp for each manor to your opponent, pay additional wood to rebuild them and also they build slower. And I was asking how this is not a weird design compared to, you know, manors simply being undeletable.

Yes, it is the player’s own responsibility to bear the consequence of knowing that manors aren’t deletable for valid reasons and that it is barely a problem.

51

The only way I see that the English can destroy their houses is with an adjustment in the cost of creating the houses (100 food and Wood) in a nutshell nullifying the house boom

52

No, I don’t think that’s weird at all.

In addition to preventing abuse, the meaning why no new settlers are spawned when rebuilding the manor deleted by the player is that the settler spawned by that manor is already in the game, and the player just spends the same cost and time to reconstruct it elsewhere, so the cost remains the same but only provides population this time. On the other hand, a manor destroyed by an opponent can spawn a new settler so that the existing gameplay can be maintained.

Deletion is not required behavior. It all makes no difference as long as the manor is not deleted. If the player already knows the cost of the manor and the existence of this mechanic, and still wants to delete for any personal reason, then this is what he should pay.

Unless you want the manor will only cost the same cost, time and create the same bounty XP as a normal house when the counter reaches 0.

53

“Oh yeah I want to make my town more beautiful, let me just delete these manors and donate my opponent a whopping amount of xp so that he gets a shipment or two ready. I don’t mind paying unusually extra wood for these totally normal houses. That’s not weird at all.” lol

Yeah remove the civ’s bonus entirely for making them deletable.

Good luck, mate.

1 Like
54

Are you the type of player who will deliberately delete buildings to strengthen your opponent?
If not, why should you worry? As long as you don’t delete it, it’s fine, it’s your own decision.

All of this is just for players who want to delete their own buildings, including TCs, forts, wonders, factories and even manors, for any reason. If you’re not one of those people, it has nothing to do with you at all.

Your concern is strange actually.

Hey, it’s all out of your whining about the cost.
I don’t see the need to change the cost at all from the start.

Not to mention that the counter doesn’t obliterate the character of civilization at all. It still completely retains the existing bonus of the game, which at least 20 settlers are still available through the manor. Your concerns about this mechanic are really unreasonable.

55

Assuming you really want to move manors, the easiest way is to allow moving existing manors.

But as I mentioned earlier, the fact that you cannot delete them is part of the British boom skill floor. Your need to think where to place those manors to

  1. Grant your map and resource control.
  2. Not hinder your own development.

Allowing Britain to relocate manors is a huge buff that i personally don’t think they need.

This may not be obvious in treaty, which is what the majority of the posters here play, but it is a huge aspect in supremacy.

56

one possible coding error that could cause some bugs is what if you delete a manor and only partially build a manor in a place that the enemy will easily siege down either on purpose or by accident. so you build that manor up to a few HP, would it trigger the counter as being destroyed?

so what could happen is you put a proxy manor near their base they destroy it and the counter thinks the enemy did it and not a deletion, before built and then you can build the extra manor somewhere else and get the 21st villager. and so on.

2 Likes
57

Why do you guys think that making the manor deletable = encouraging players to delete the manor?

We always carefully choose where to place every buildings such as TCs, forts, wonders, factories, etc., as well as manors, but also there will always be a moment when someone wants to delete a certain building. Since deleting the manors doesn’t bring British boom under the suggestion, making them deleteable doesn’t change any existing British gameplay at all.

Stop being afraid of it please.

No there will no bug.

  1. The completed manor you deleted first does not affect the counter.
  2. The destroyed partially built manor does not affect the counter too since it is not completed and has not spawned a settler. The uncompleted manor cannot decrease the counter so the counter also cannot increase when it is destroyed.

None of this is a problem when you have an idea of coding.

Did you know that if you wanna abuse the manor in this way, “the current undeletable manor” will work too?

Since my suggestion completely preserves the existing gameplay, I will not deny this possibility, after all, this is already allowed by the existing gameplay.

This is not at all a problem with deletable manors.

58

no the current system does not allow this because you do not get a free villlager until the building is completed.

but if you make it a counter system what prevents a destroyed manor returning your resources, but setting the counter back so that another manor could be built to spawn the villager. In this case you do not want to complete the manor because no villager would be created. what you want is to trick the computer into thinking a manor is destroyed to set the counter back to complete the manor and actually spawn the villager.

here is how it looks… you make 20 houses. you delete 1. you still have 20 vils. you half build a manor near the enemy base. it returns most of your res, but thinks it should say you now have 19 counted manors since one was destroyed. you build a manor with most of the returned wood and now have 21 vils possible, multiplying your manor vils by tricking the enemy into destroying half built manors.

I am not sure how the coding works, I am not even sure if u get XP for destroying foundations, or if in the final game review screen in the buildings destroyed section does it count half built buildings. If it does then it would seem some extra lines of code would be necessary to prevent this.

1 Like
59

Since you didn’t say that the proxy manor is uncompleted, I regarded it is a completed one.
The current completed undeletable manors are allowed to do that way too, so I said that.
I have already explained what if the the deletable manor is uncompleted.

No it will not be tricked since it is entirely possible to technically judge whether a building is completed.
For a well-understood example, the system definitely know which manors are completed and which are not, so it can figure out what population should be and the moment to give bounty XP.

I do think you are overthinking it. Take it easy.

60

I want to say “get good” because 99% of your problems here are your inability to play the Brits effectively if this is actually a problem for you.

The other solution is to leave them undeletable, but allow them to be upgraded like a wall to allow units to walk through them, but not enemies.

2 Likes