Migration Perriod DLC concept

Age of Empires II: DE II - Discussion
1

A DLC that focused on the time after the Fall of the Roman Empire.

All suggestions are incomplete and just ideas. Feel free to add your own ideas.

New Civilisation

  • Vandals
  • Alans
  • Saxons
  • Suebi

Reworked Civilisations

  • Goths
  • Huns
  • Armenians
  • Byzantines

Regional Units

Huskarl

  • Pierce Armour reduced by 4 down to 2 (4 Elite)
  • This is compensated by the civs (other then Goths) having Plate Mail Armour
  • Anarchy restores the old Pierce armour for Goths instead of enabling them at the Barracks
  • Now have Shock Infantry armour class
  • All other stats unchanged
  • Cost is at 75 Food and 35 Gold without the Goths discount
  • Available to Goths, Vandals and Saxons

Cataphract

  • Available at the Stable for Byzantines and Armenians
  • Does not replace the Knight Line

Vandals

Cavalry and Infantry civilisation

Bonuses

  • Melee Units +1/+2/+3 attack in Feudal/Castle/Imperial Age
  • Infantry and Cavalry generate Gold from destroying Buildings
  • Hunters generate additional 25% Gold

Team bonus

Unique Unit

  • Torch Thrower: short range anti building Infantry (Causes burn damage to Buildings and Siege Units)

Unique Technologies

  • Castle Age:
  • Imperial Age: Galley Line +3 attack

Available Technologies and Units

  • (Elite) Huskarl
  • Paladin
  • (Heavy) Camel Rider
  • Dromon

Missing Technologies

  • Plate Barding Armour
  • Gambesons
  • Bracer
  • Halberdier
  • All gunpowder units

Concept

This civilisations kinda inverts the usual roles of Cavalry and Infantry. Their Cavalry is missing pierce armour but they have access to Huskarls.
Their Melee units are fragile but have a strong attack.

Alans

Cavalry Archer civilisation

Bonuses

  • Steppe Lancers and Cavalry Archer generate 5 Gold per kill and heal 10 HP
  • Light Cavalry Archer available in Feudal Age (automatically upgrades in Castle Age like Camel Scout)
  • Have access to Mule Carts
  • Free Mule Cart on Age Up
  • Have access to Pastures

Team bonus

  • Alan Mercenary available at the Castle

Unique Units

  • Light Cavalry Archer: Feudal Age Cavalry Archer (with negative Cavalry Archer armour)
  • Alan Mercenary: Quickly trained Cavalry Archer with bonus damage vs. Cavalry that only costs Gold

Unique Technology

  • Castle Age: Mounted Units +10 HP
  • Imperial Age: Alan Mercenary refunds part of its cost on death (that applies to allied ones too, the Gold goes to you)

Available Technologies and Units

  • Parthian Tactics and Thumbring
  • (Elite) Steppe Lancers
  • Dromon

Missing Technologies

  • Paladin
  • Gambesons
  • Halberdier
  • Champion
  • Camel Rider
  • All gunpowder units

Concept

Civilisation with a wide selection of good cavalry units.
The only civilisation without an Elite Upgrade for their Unique Unit. Their Imperial Age UT gives them Gold when their allies train their shared unique unit.

Saxons

Infantry and Naval civilisation. Take over the Armenian Infantry bonuses.

Bonuses

  • Infantry units (beside MAA) available one Age earlier (including Elite Huskarl)
  • One Free Transport Ship with the first Dock
  • Miners (both Gold and Stone) generate additional 25% Food

Team bonus

  • Infantry +2 Line of Sight

Unique Unit

  • Aetheling: Expensive cavalry with bonus damage vs. Infantry. Gains HP 10 for every kill (up to +50)

Unique Technology

  • Castle Age: All units generate Wood by killing Siege Units and Ships
  • Imperial Age: Infantry +30 HP (besides Spearman Line)

Available Technologies and Units

  • Paladin
  • Dromon

Missing Technologies

  • Bracer
  • Thumbring
  • All gunpowder units

Concept

They are representing both the Continental Saxons and the Anglo Saxons from the British Isles.
Their trait is durable Infantry, especially with their Huskarl but their Knights are pretty strong too because they are fully upgraded including Paladin.

Suebi

Infantry and Gunpowder civilisation

Bonuses

  • Villagers can drop of resources at Castles
  • Spearman Line +1/+2 Spearman Armour in Castle/Imperial Age
  • Free Spearman/Skirmisher/Scout for ever Barracks/Archery Range/Stable built

Team bonus

  • Villages +5 HP

Unique Unit

  • Landsknecht/Reisläufer: Expensive heavy Infantry that does AoE damage
  • Culverin: Medium range cannon with small AoE damage, good against Siege Weapons and Elephants

Unique Technology

  • Castle Age: Castles slowly trickle Gold and work 50% faster
  • Imperial Age: Archery Range Units move 10% faster (Excluding Cavalry Archers)

Available Technologies and Units

  • Paladin
  • Hand Cannon
  • Bombard Cannon
  • Siege Engineers
  • Elite Cannon Galleon

Missing Technologies

  • Thumb Ring
  • Bloodlines
  • Parthian Tactics
  • Hussar

Concept

The Suebi split into multiple parts, some moved to modern day Spain/Portugal but some stayed in Germany/Switzerland. I decided to represent them more as the Late Medieval Germans to add more variety to the DLC.
They have a relatively wide techtree but no strong bonuses for any particular unit in the late game.
Their free Scout bonus sounds powerful but they are missing Bloodlines and the Hussar upgrade. They have Paladins though.
Their Archers are missing Thumbring but move faster. That applies to their Hand Cannons too.

Changed to existing civilisations

Goths

  • Anarchy: Huskarl +4 Pierce Armour (just restores old stats)
  • New UU: Mounted Throwing Axeman Ranged unit that counters Infantry and Siege units
  • Lose access to Hand and Bombard Cannons

Huns

  • Lose Access to Plate Barding Armour
  • Gain Access to Steppe Lancer
  • Gain Access to Pasture
  • Discount apples to Cavalry Archer and Steppe Lancers now
  • Elite Tarkan +1/+1 armour (Compensation for missing Plate Barding Armour)

Armenians

  • Gain access to Cataphract
  • Gain access to Plate Barding Armour
  • Lose their early Infantry upgrade civ bous
  • New Imperial Age UT: Catapharcts have charged ranged attack from the Composite Bowman (ignores armour)

Byzantines

  • Gain Access to Legionary
  • Cataphract now at the Stable
  • New UU either Varangian Guard or Flame Thrower
  • Varangian Guard: Infantry with +2/+2 armour close to allied Castles, Towers and Town Centres
  • Flame Thrower: Infantry unit with Fire Galley like attack

Campaigns

  • Roman campaign
  • Saxon campaign
  • Vandal and Alan combined campaign
10 Likes
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Super! You could add campaigns, wonders, castles and architectures. Vandal and Alan wonders/castles could be tricky to find.

I’d argue that Vandals could be more of a naval and cav civ with ok infantry.

If Vandals/Alans get heavy camels and Byzantines get legionaries (with this I’d personally disagree with), Romans should get the first Camel rider and cataphracts I guess.

This is very flavourful but maybe not strong enough, why not give them a transport for every dock built?

Lots of possibilities for the dark age, I’d like to see Nubians, Gokturks and Himyarites one day.

Nubians and Himyarites could be added in the same DLC focused on early Ethiopia and the invasion of Yemen where they fought the Sassanids + early Muslim invasion of Egypt. Nubians would take from Ethiopians the archer bonus so Ethiopians would need a major rework.

Gokturks should get pastures. Guptas and Hunas or Hepthalites could be added in the same DLC.

1 Like
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These new civ designs lack flavor and uniqueness. I recommend seeing my designs for them as a starting point. But the overall changes to other civilizations seem fine.

4

You made good suggestions Skadilesu.

Make Huskarl regional unit unit : yes, originally there were a saxon unit.
Make Cataphract a regional : yes I agree, I find nice picture of armenian Cataphract

Give Palitonon to the romans, huns, goths and new civilizations, a nice skin of the trebuchet and historically accurate. Trebuchet were not is use in Europe in this time they still use torsion engine.

Vandals

Yes there is a consensus about the vandal civilization but I think there will be an cavalry and naval civilization. After their conquest by the byzantine empires, the byzantines use them as a cavalry unit. Of course they need the camel. Also they make big used a demolition ship, they need a bonus to their demolition ship, maybe the former +50% HP of the chinese ?

Alans

Good design but I think they don’t need to have the camel because they never use them in Europe and later they merged with the vandals. Steppe lancer of course. Not having an elite upgrade for the UU is weird, they need an hidden upgrade like the fereter for the armenian warrior monk.

The Alans can also replace the mongols who play the Scythian int Attila campaign.

Saxons

I think than giving infantry upgrade one age earlier is too much like the armenian bonus maybe only for the huskarl line.

Or maybe make an unique huskarl UU like the camel scout of the Gurjaras. A feudal age huskarl who automatically upgrade to normal huskarl in the castle age. Maybe the huskarl line can have a feudal age version for all the civilizations ? Maybe 3 stage for the huskarl : earlier huskarl in feudal, huskarl in castle and elite in imperial ? Also having a feudal age stage huskarl is good because historically this unit was most in use during the feudal age and the earlier castle age

I suggest : huskarl in feudal and free upgrade for the huskarl line for the saxon.

Byzantines

I think than giving Legionary is not good for the byzantine because they don’t use them after the 7 th century.

Your concept of varangian guard is good, because there were an praetorian guard unit who protect the emperor in the city of Constantinople, so the bonus next to defensive building is good. But in AoE4 they can also build transport ship, so I suggest than in AoE2 they can repair ships (viking who a come from Scandinavia with their longship) in additon of the armor improvement next to buildings.

For the flamerthrower unit maybe but we can also make a regional of Greek fire grenadier infantry for the Byzantine and Saracen. This type of grenade were more in use than any flamethrower infantry.

Suebi

The Suebi follow the vandals In Iberia, they carved a big kingdom, look at the Wikipedia article : Kingdom of the Suebi. In 446 they control most of Iberia peninsula. A campaign in the reign of king Rechila will be good.

Campaign : the story of the Suebi people from Germany to their kingdom in Iberic peninsula. In their journey they invade Gaul with the Vandal and the Alans, after this they invade Iberic peninsula with the two former people and stay in Galicia after than the Vandals and the Alain were beaten and leave to Africa. The campaign finish with a fight against the Wisigoth in Spain.

For the UU I suggest an Angon thrower : Angon was a barber javelin. When stick in a shield she cannot be removed and lower the ranged armor. Also if he hit a body the barbed javelin cannot be removed, you death from bleeding. The angon thrower is a skrmisher or a ranged melee unit with a charged attack : every time he hit with is charged attack he lower the ranged armor of his opponent by 1 (like an obuch) and only the ranged armor. Also the charged attack make more damage (maybe a progressive damage like the Lio dao of the Khitan)

Campaigns

For the Romains campaign I suggest the Aegidus campaign from Manu la Capuche, also he have released a coop version of this campaign this days.

Vandals : of course, the Genseric scenario is too short for their journey. Mixing the Alans is good because without the vandals I don’t know how to make a campaign for them.
Saxons : new civ new campaign. But I don’t want a campaign against Charlemagne, it’s better to put them in England against the Celts.

For the name of the DLC I suggest : Barbarian Invasions I made a topic about this : The future of Roman civilization in AoE2 after Chronicles + DLC and marketing proposal

I suggest that this DLC give access to the romain civilization for those who don’t care about AoE1 and don’t want to buy Return of Rome just for the Romain.

Clovis Campaign

I have made a concept of Clovis Campaign

The man who found my country. In this time the franks were not the mighty knights there were footed soldier who throw axe (la francisque !). The campaign can be related by St Remigius, Bishop of Reims who convert Clovis. This campaign talk about the combat of Clovis and his progressive adoption of christianity.
Maybe in this campaign you can have the axe thrower in the barracks and the knight line in the castle.

1 Battle of Soissons : he fight Syagrius the last roman here. Also don’t forget to talk about the Vase of Soissons in the cutscene : Souvient toi du vase de Soissons ! (Remember the Vase of Soissons)

2 battle of Tolbiac : he fight the Alamans and chose to convert to christianity here. Also you can conquer the thuringian kingdom (your mother was thuringian) In the end cutscene talk about his baptism to christianity in Reims here.

3 Fight against the burgundian : he fight the burgundian, here the reskin of the burgundian Coustillier in a axe rider in Aegidius campaign can be useful.

4 Battle of Vouillé : he fight against the Wisigoth. Now Clovis is a catholic christian and can sell to his new gallo roman catholic subdjet that this war is a religious war against the arianic christian wisigoths. In this scenario you have option to beat this wisigoth making you allyes. Yo can let your frankish warriors who are still pagan to loot the church to have resource or you can protect the church to gain support of the local gallo roman catholic population (you gain legionary and centurion), but if you support the christian your frankish pagan warrior can revolt.

5 Unification of the Franks : There is various frankish kingdoms in this time, in order to unify the frank : assassinate the other frankish kings !

2 Likes
5

Very true, forgot about that one.

Yeah right. Maybe give their UU a bonus vs. Cavalry to make up for that.

Their UT is practically a heavy discount.
But it could also be ine of those weaker Elite Upgrades that like only add 5 HP.

The idea is to remove that bonus from the Armenians. The same with their UT that gives Infantry +30 HP.

I thought about them too. Like the Saxons they split and some stayed in Germany. Alternative name could be Alamanni. But that name could be confusing because it’s the name of Germany in like half the languages.

That would actually be a cool name.

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The Alans have absolutely no elements of their eastern counterpart, and they absolutely need to. In fact, my Alans concept was primarily based on the Kingdom of Alania and not the Western Alans. Regardless of how you choose to approach it, they should have Camels as well as Steppe Lancers and could even have Fortified Churches. Only representing the Western Alans is a huge misstep in my opinion.

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Picts would also be relevant, specially if they want to make a proper Scottish civ without the woad raider, but I doubt they’re gonna ever modify William Wallace.

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Do they?
We have a lot of Central Asian/Eastern European nomadic civilisations in the game. Having one that is not focused on this region would be more interesting.

The Alans settled in multiple parts of Europe where they didn’t have access to Camels anymore.
Maybe the solution would be to give them Camel Riders without the Heavy upgrade but that would be too similar to the Cumans.

Maybe one day. I wish ever DLC could have like 5 new civilisations instead of just 2.

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Roman campaign : Aetius & Majorian

1- The Catalaunian Fields on the roman side : try getting allies to face Attila (Attila 4 & 5 on the other side)

2- Defence of Italy. Attila 6 on the other side

3- a double mission, both small-scale. On the one hand trying to assassinate Attila as retaliation for his attacks, then having Aetius assassinated and getting Majorian to survive the vandal sack of Rome to be crowned emperor and repel the raiders
(A bit ahistorical but it would make some interesting gameplay)

4- Reconquest of Gaul

5- Reconquest of Hispania & failed reconquest of Africa

6- Epilogue : Soissons : a survival scenario in which you have to survive for some time, until the Franks of Clovis arrive, while witnessing Rome itself fall

1 Like
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The only issue is it’s already the name of the expansion for Rome TW. It may cause some copyright issues.

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Did an update to my post:

  • Added Suebi
  • Removed Camel Riders from Alans
  • Gave Alans Mule Carts (Caucasus Reference) and Pastures
  • Gave Alan UU bonus damage vs. Cavalry to make up for the loss of Camel Rider and to differentiate them from normal Cavalry Archers

After the last DLC not having any civilisation that can train Knights I thought it was interesting to do the opposite and give all civs Knights and some even Paladin this time.

For the Suebi I decided to go a lot more Modern and give them a Gunpowder focus. Also a good excuse to finally add Landsknecht and Culverin to AoE2.

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Good suggestions. But what about Belisarius? I know he came from Eastern Rome, but at that point it was still indistinguishable from the Western Romans. A mission about taking Naples using the aqueducts would be so dope.

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Wouldn’t that overlap a bit with the Teuton civ and Barbarossa’s campaign?

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Barbarossa lived long before gunpoweder and Landsknechts.
He was Suebian but the rules over all of the HRE which is better represented by the Teutones. Maybe you could play as Suebi in the first mission.

Having Saxons as civ already means some reworks of that campaign and of course the Hastings mission.

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Not a fan of such a DLC. Compared with the Three Kingdoms, this is obviously much more legal, though.
But it will still be controversial though. Some people still don’t think Romans and Huns make sense for AoE2, and many people do not want anymore Euorpean civs especially controversial ones.
To me, I think it’s more likely that just one AoE2 civ, probably the Vandals, can be introduced as a promotion when a DLC is released for RoR or Chronicles, rather than a regular DLC.

Not a fan, for reasons other than historical accuracy. Just feels unnecessary, and having such a unit so effective against infantry in Stables should have a big impact on balance.

I would simply like to make the Knight line of these two civs more useful. Give fully upgraded Paladin to Armenians, and possibly remove Paladin from Byzantines if needed after the Logistica allows Knights to have trample damage within 0.5 tiles.

Where is the Navy?

Like the Burmese bonus but simply stronger since this affects cavalry also.

25% is too high.

Could it be named Arsonist?
But if there is any mechanic that can simulate burning, I would give it priority to Tarkan. It have been holding the torch for over 20 years.

Having a DOG unique unit will be absolutely interesting!
it could have 5 or 6 attack, and also could help gather food from huntable and herdable animals, but it would not have upgrades.

No. Healing through ranged attacks would be extremely annoying.

Mule Cart should be unique to Georgians only, while Warrior Priest and Foritfied Church should be available both to Armenians and Georgians.
As for the potential Caucasian civs other than them, I think it is enough to just have Foritfied Church as a regional building.

No Elite Huskarl in Castle Age.
I’d only allowing Longsword and Pike in Feudal Age and Two-handed and Halberd in Castle Age is fairly enough.

You must choose either gold or stone. Also, 25% is too high.

It feels very easy to be broken. Kill a fragile unit like a skirmisher and it can gain a powerful buff.

The most unnecessary one among these 4. We already have the Teutons and the Burgundians.
The Landsknecht could replace the Two-handed for the Teutons, and it could have a charge bar to sweep enemy with trample damage (no additional attack).
The gunpowder bonus of the Burgundians could become a new UT named Culverins for replacing the Revolution, after the Revolution could become a tech in TCs that is bannable in the room settings so the match can decide to ban it if needed.

I’d like to rename Anarchy to Shield Wall for such a effect.
Mounted Throwing Axeman feels cool.

Elite Steppe Lancer on discount still cannot make up the lose of fully upgraded Paladin in my opinion.

Well, I have learned that the classical infantry legionnaire of the Byzantines was disappearing pretty fast.

The Flamethrower is absolutely cooler!
When the Cataphract is in Castles, the Flamethrower can be trainable in Siege Workshops and benefit from the Greek Fire.
Meanwhile the current Flamethrower with chinese style dragon nozzle could be renamed and trainable in Siege Workshops for the Chinese.

If we only have one Vandals, because of the situation I mentioned at the beginning, then this civ would most likely be combined with Alanis, for example, let it have Alaunt and an Alani horseman as UUs, and then this civ can well represent this campaigns.

1 Like
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Having more than 1 campaign for some civs ? You’re preaching to the choir. Belisarius would be on my list of byzantine campaigns, though you may use the Romans on some missions

18

well, my point is that if Suebian represent the Ancient Antiquity and Early Modern Era, then they should represent the Medieval people, kinda Bolzano theorem xd.

But, yeah, something like this could work. Most Teuton factions in the first mission could also be replaced by these new civs.
And what about doing something similar to the Saxons and giving them something realted to the Hanseatic League?

True, but these new civs outlasted both of them by centuries (well maybe the Vandals only like 50 years), so it’s not bad at all.

Actually my suggestion was making Belisarius as a 100% Roman campaign (except maybe a mission for the Lazic War), since they were pretty much still the same as the Western Romans, was only half a century after the end of the West, they were still using Latin and so on.
For a more “Byzantine” campaign I would go with Basil II or Alexios I. I know Bari is a campaign and there is a battle for Alexios in V&V, but I think the Byzantines deserves a full campaign with either emperor.

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Maybe giving the Romans some byzantine elements (cataphracts notably) for Belisarius ?

Let’s also not forget Heraclius.

A civ with such a rich history. Pick a fictional family at the edge of the empire.

1 Like
20

I occasionally play with the Goths, but I would never touch them again if they lost Anarchy, Hand Cannoneers, and Bombard Cannons. Huskarl losing its unique unit status and taking extra damage from the recently buffed Militia line would be the last nail in the Goths’ coffin—potentially making them the weakest civilization.

21

May have to buff their regular infantry, it’s always possible to adjust their cost. Maybe making their infantry take 0.8 population for more swarming, this would fit their cost discount nicely.

To double down on the quantity, how about finally fixing their +10 pop in imperial age by making it +8% (+2 per slice of 25) ? Which would raise to +16 for a standard 200 pop game and would make it more consistant if picking different game options (if you set the limit to 25 it’s currently a massive +40%…)

1 Like