Wasn’t this thread about bohemians?
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Well, people often try to distract and shift attention onto other things if they heavily disagree with a proposal.
It’s fine. There are many other civs that fall off after their power spike is over. They’re already a very solid civ, so at the moment I don’t see any justification for buffing them.
That’s just your opinion then. Anyways, this thread is about the Bohemians, not Poles.
Yeah well it’s in-line with the design of most other civs… so I don’t see what you’re on about.
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Besides the hussite wagon (whose attack imput is worse than expected), i think any other of their strategies are manageable.
Their better trush (stone upgrades, discounted blacksmith) feel more and less similar to other trusher civs.
Their scout rush into castle age HC (given that they cost food and dont require archer attack upgrades) is not broken at all and feels a worse version of turks scouts into jannisaires (but dont require a castle)
Their monktrash spam… I havent seen it yet
Houfnices in arabia are rare to see wcept when they are winning
So the only posible OP strategy left is chemistey crossbows. This is an interesting powerspike although they lack thumbring.
Ps: has anyone tried a castle drop with sanctity villagers?
Too much investment. If you want to make a castle drop you want to use the powerspike. You don’t want to place a monastery and research some techs first.
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Oh, i see, it would only work if you delay the time of the castle drop, and by then oponents may have siege or units
Still, it looks interesting for clowning in arena against booming oponents
Bohemians look like a very strong fast imperial monk civ on arena and like a very strong xbow vs knight civ.
Trashmonks is a really weak UT - if your clowning you dont have foodeco after a fast imp. When gold is running out the units are left are skirms/halbs/hussar - pretty sure you dont want to play monks vs that. I think its one of the least useful UTs of all civs - it can be good very rarely.
The wagon is rly strong vs archer units and terrible vs any melee units/siege/redemption monks. All in all it can be rly strong vs a civ like koreans - but normally its a unit you can add few if your opponent is xbow. Wagon/halb isnt that strong as the wagons do low dps and gets demolished by infrantry/siege guy claiming its unbeatable.
Its funny how everybody always calls for nerfs bc they got no clue how to play vs the new civ - ofc its always imbalance not incompetence.
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This.
20 character limit
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I was wondering why not more people were bringing this up. Chemistry xbows in Castle age are truly strong against knights. Normally a knight with +2 and bloodlines requires 40 shots from an xbow to go down, but with chemistry Bohemian xbows can do it in 30 - almost like fighting knights with the bracer upgrade, minus the range increase. Now I dont think this is OP 1v1 because skirmishers easily counter you, however, in team games I have seen it work very well. Since the meta is archers + knights, the team with bohemian chemistry xbows will be able to pick of knights with more ease, compared to the other team. Ive seen bohemian xbows outperform britons and even Ethiopian xbows in that role.
Not saying it’s necessarily OP but it sure is a strong powerspike in team games
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Don’'t think so, in TG scaling is king, so missing thumb ring on your arbs is really bad.
Think both civs are quite bad TG civs.
OK, archer civs can get away with bad scaling, but I don’t place bohemians in a good spot, though it might be better TG civ than poles.
I thought so too at first, maybe on the pro level it is true but once you get around 2k5 team game elo and below i watched to astonishment how strong that bonus can be. The reason is that you are way more likely to have 30 xbows when +2 knights come out, and that when knights engage on your xbows you will be able to one shot them much longer than other civs. And once your opponent’s pocket loses knight numbers, your pocket can pounce on enemy xbows - it’s hard to get back from falling behind like that anyways
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OK, if there are communication issues it can be very strong against cav, that’s given.
But idk…It’s also situational. It only works if the cav player blindly throws his knights into the xbows not knowing that they deal extra damage.
With the Bohemians being new that might indeed be a factor here
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I have to admit that seeing Castle Age Chemistry used to boost Crossbowmen instead of building hand cannoneers makes me die inside a bit 
Not unexpected…just sad.
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From what I see Bohemians are OK at the moment. Hussite Wagon should get speed slightly reduced and train time increased. Chem xbow is very good, but they also lack thumb ring and its their only real best option if people know how to play against wagon. Post-imp game they’re pretty good with Halb + Wagon + Houfnice but its very expensive and immobile comp.
Their civ bonuses are kinda nuts, but then again their cavalry is absolutely horrible and their archery range is far weaker than most archer civs. Lacking siege ram hurts as well.
I agree fully with everything you said there. Poles are OP in feudal and castle. It’s their mass knights and farming bonus that is OP (SotL recently showcased a video of how Pole farming is even stronger than Slavs!).
It is, indeed, true that they are weak, or weakish, in Imp.
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Bohemians getting castle age gunpowder is unhistorically accurate so I really dont care. Either way main reason no one uses HC is that theres no good strat to do with Bohemians to transition into them. Castle age hand canoneer is better for a cav civ
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The Slavic bonus is still stronger simply because its more expensive and inconvenient to build around folwarks instead of around TCs and you can be raided more easily.
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