But it is boring, and the same effect as the already existing Pavise or the Vietnamese bonus.
This land bonus for Italians should make them multidimensional on land like the how the one-dimensional Turks were given good CA.
We don;t just do changes because they’re easy. They have to be exciting and generate interest and entertainment as well, and make the civilization interesting for a long while, which is only possible by making it unique.
You talk as if Scorpions have no cost effective counters
In fact, of all siege workshop units, they probably have the most cost effective counters
At 450W they will be only 100W less than making them at the base market selling rate
450W?
It’s too much.
You already need 80+ farmers in the lategame
Exactly which is why I argued for 400W.
But @DoctBaghi here didn’t agree even with 500W , saying it is too OP 
250 wood (20 characters)
castle age scorpions in imp…
Do Italians not have Heavy scorps? Good then, I think 300-350W should be a good price
It will make the civilization multidimensional on-land, as well as be a unique civ bonus
They don’t even have Heavy Scorps OR EVEN SE lol, and as @CheshireWig3203 mentions, their siege is very underwhelming to what would be expected of a Byzantine origin civilization.
And scorpions are the defensive siege unit.
They have garbage siege tree: missing Siege Ram, Heavy Scorpion, SO, Siege Engineers so devs don’t need to ban technologies
Please just make the bonus in the common style.
The way the change is written is that you leave untouched the discount on gunpowder, FS, trade units and so on.
The other units are 5% cheaper. Common style bonus as asked by @UpmostRook9474. In dark age it is approximately 50f for 20 vill. Assuming you do 30 archers and, say 40 vills in feudal (really huge war) it is around 200 resources but obtained along all the age (so way weaker than the 200 resources obtained by Ethiopians that are got instantly).
Turks do btw.
Every civilization should have multiple (if not as many as possible) strategies executable on land, so as not to not make them predictable. The Italians should not end up a one-trick-pony on land (which they arguably currently are), as should most civs, since that is a boring way to enjoy this game of counters and millitary strategies.
Other trash unit options:
Trash Capped Rams without Siege Engineers or Battering Rams with Siege Engineers
Hussars with +1/2/3 pierce armor (I don’t like this…)
The common style means like making some tech or units cheaper, research or train faster, or some data of a unit get better, etc. Just like the other civ do. Since it is a new additional bonus that will make the player learn it easily and the dev team do and balance it easily.
So my suggestions do fit in your notion of common style, as they all make a stat associated with a unit-line better!
their siege is very underwhelming to what would be expected of a Byzantine origin civilization.
And scorpions are the defensive siege unit. So trash non-heavy non-Siege Engineers scorpions done in a balanced way, would be fitting thematically, and also make them multi-pronged and a full fledged land civilization.
Or you could go for a more aggressive take and go for Trash rams.
This penalizes my idea of gold trickle but boost the one of general discount on all units… overall I like the approach, however some out of the box buff (khmer farmers) are really nice, despite difficult to balance
so, this is around 50 res in dark age. At most 200 resources in feudal.
A nerfed dock discount at 30% is a lost of around 300 resources in the beginning of castle age.
@Sylux1000 what do you think of the Trash non-heavy non-Siege Engineers scorpions idea for Italians?
It’s the same Byzantine-buff idea, now after the Byzantine buff seems even better applied to the one-dimensional-on-land Italians
Italians are not one dimensional, they actually have a lot of options once they get to imperial. The problem is getting there. A scorp trash unit won’t really help with that.
They only have arbs(and GC which are also basically arbs). And BBC is not really a main army unit, they’re a treb substitute.
HC are underpowered and not worth it even for the Italians, outside of specific circumstances.
This is very good for turks. Italians need help in the earlier stages. We can open a parallel topic on turks, I will join for sure
Yes Turks Trash Scorps is great too, but I think this idea works great for Italians too