Yeah fishing overall got nerfed, but my point is that you didn’t change the overall flow of the game and issue, just nerfed the longterm efficiency/durability of it.
Mongolian heights, confluence and danube will still be played the exact same, cause skipping fishing would be stupid since it’s an easy insta eco growth with either a 0 risk for them until they already payed off, or tower-/dock-creeping across the entire river to lock down individual fishing spots.
I agree that fishing needs a tweaking, but what they’ve nerfed is that fishing doesn’t pay off as quickly and they run out at 15 min instead of 20 min.
Fish running out at min 20 was too long was never the issue as far as I could see but that river maps pretty much played like water maps, since forward docking instantly at minute 1 has literally no risk involved due to a lack of counterplay against ships.
And this issue hasn’t been adressed at all.
Ah and Beasty said that Abasid techtime was the best change, not the fishing one
in my opinion fish will always be must to use, bu the question : Can player abaddon fish in the feudal for land aggression or land boom.
the issue was, that you can fish 20+ minute with 30 boats. because in the lake you had 10k food.
now 30 boats = 2225 wood + dock only for 5k food.
But it’s much better approach, than 150 wood for boat, so noone would build fish. Cause if fish are lost wood investments were so huge, that you out of the game.
Anyway, i do not know is it balanced or not yet. But their changes have deep thoughts inside…try to understand it.
That’s why i proposed SOTL
Or aoe2 had an amazing hybrit tournament, where fish were perfectly balanced.
Because different number of fish in the ponds every map played differently: dark age == must, but you could loose fish in the feudal, because you get beck investments on dock + 4 fishboats. And even if opponent won water, 10 fishing boats for lake - max. Huge advantage, but it’s not 30+
This is completely begging the question.
Just saying “they probably know what they’re doing” is doing all the hard work here for your argumentation and implies by default taht we shouldn’t give our analysis/opinion on this cause we have no idea.
If that twisted logic would apply, we wouldn’t have these issues in the first place.
Again, I think fishing should be viable but the way you balance is encouraging counterplay.
I want fishing to be strong, I don’t want fishing to become as weak and useless that it’s on the same level as quick expansion so you can technically ignore water and it doesn’t matter.
But building aditional eco boom in the center of the map cause there is little to no counterplay to it is just terrible.
Fishingships should be way unsafer and be raidable by small archer numbers and don’t have this safehaven they can hug around where you need 12+ archers to counteract the heal of the dock.
Beeing able to grow your eco with another building is insentive enough to try to aim for it.
All these changes, multiple fishing rate nerfs, fish amount nerf and +25 woodcost for fishing ship increase is not adressing the issue that rivermaps play like watermaps cause you insta dock with little to no risk, even tho beeing perfectly reachable for enemy units.
Those changes just make fishing unappealing overall, which should not be the goal.
You should encourage counterplay instead of nerfing the whole thing into the ground and hope players play differently now.
Siege suffers from the same issue.
Beeing forced to mirror what your oponent does cause there is little to no counterplay is just bad gamedesign.
Maybe the fishing rate and amount were too high, but I’m just frustrated that they don’t seem to adress the issues listed before.
I can’t understand how the French artillery didn’t change. Bomber movement speed nerfed from 0.88 to 0.62, I thought the cannons would also be adjusted to 0.62. Isn’t that what it should be? but. Maybe it was forgotten to change, or it may be to reflect the superiority of the cannon. But the 0.26 speed difference, is this really suitable? It is currently the fastest siege machine. Much faster than Mangonel, same as Springald. And it doesn’t have to pack and unpack to change state. That’s just 80hp less than the bomber, but it’s way too much of an advantage. Its rapid movement is like an anomaly in bombers and all sieges. If it has to move faster than the bomber by design, it only needs to be slightly faster to be superior. Now it’s more of an outlier.
Your “Highly convinced” is the one im most unconvinced about. The main problem in water is once you get a lead over your enemy you can snowball it. The healing circle is the only way to defend an early disadvantage you may have in water.
Your two other points I actually agree with
I think you’re doing an excellent job!
Look on Reddit and discord for a break from constant toxic environment here
The happy players aren’t nearly as loud as the disgruntled attention seekers
Bdelloid had already uninstalled the game and sworn it off, while driving many away from playing with constant soothsaying and toxicity, he is a lost cause, forget about the lost cause customers, focus on the star customers that bring in more business and make you happy.
Please, Dev.
Do ignore those loud clowns keeping cry that something is op but underperforming. ESPECIALLY THOSE CHINESE Civ PLAYERS
They just spoiled by FL, Bombard EZ win. Once they get nerf they start crying cuz they cannot rely on those to get auto win. And I would say that almost 80% of Chinese players are Chinese because they have more ppl than our did.
We all had good time from this game, but not with Chinese Bombrad and FL.
So how do you explain China’s mediocre winrates before the patch and terrible winrates post-patch? All those China players abusing their op siege only translated into a 47% winrate prepatch.
For the record, my position is that while siege and China siege did need to get nerfed, they needed to give China a compensatory buff to non-siege, and they went way overboard.
It’s easy to balance the game. For example the Chinese, let the Tang Dynasty have zhugenu and the Song Dynasty have palace guards to fix the bug that has always existed in nest of bee. In this way, the Chinese will become very competitive on any map.
I guess you’re here to be scolded. You haven’t played Chinese 1v1, it’s a joke to make these remarks. You should try to stay away from playing 4v4 with those noobs, which will improve your game level a lot, rather than laughing at the Chinese firelander and bombard.
1v1 is a direct proof of the strength of this civilization. 4v4 what can those multiplayer games prove? It doesn’t matter who is strong or weak in the scuffle of various civilizations, because they can complement each other. So you will think that the Chinese are 4v4 very strong, but this is normal, because the Chinese are a powerful gunpowder civilization in the later stage. In multiplayer games, Chinese people can reach the later stage safely. Do you really think you can find game balance from 4v4?
