North America, Lakota, Hauds, and a new DLC: Poll

Changes to Germany will be implemented in the future, while changes to Lakota have already been done. So this non-gaming suggestion for Lakota should be discontinued. Because it doesn’t help the gameplay in any way. It just makes some people happy. Asian Civilizations are always worse than Lakota or anything when it comes to civilization design, but I know it’s just a historical style rts game, and I’m not complaining about that.
Because this is just an unpopular rts game, game, game, not real history, history, history.

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Please read this again. There are 12 references in the entire civ that specify the Lakota - prior to the DE, there were more Cheyenne references than Lakota.
The civ is not Lakota. The Ottomans have more references to Ottoman history and culture in their Mosque upgrades than the Lakota have in their entire civ.

Addition: In the base game, there were zero Lakota references in the civ. There was more support for the civ being the Cheyenne than the Lakota, and the bad voice-overs would imply that the civ was a Cheyenne band trying to be bilingual in Lakota.

Half of the reworks have made them objectively worse. The tribal marketplace has got to be the dumbest thing in the game and needs to be scrapped or massively reworked. I don’t even want to play these civs because of this annoying change.

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Then I suggest you take a look at the history of Asia, you will find that the Asian civilization designed by bhg is just like rubbish.

Obviously China, Japan, India, there are so many historical materials, books, pictures, weapons and equipment that have been passed down to modern times, but bhg will only refer to Osprey Publishing’s stereotyped East Asian atlas to design the unit

Updates are not limited to only one or two time. But it’s important to fairly give every civilization chances to having updates, and strike a reasonable balance between the game’s entertainment, historical accuracy, and acceptable development costs.

On the other hand, the Germans, Indians and Native Americans, their respective issues are actually quite different. Comparing them won’t do any help to improve the status quo.

About the Germans:

It’s a bit outdated due to the release of the new DLC, but the concept may be still good.

This answered your question.

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I counted Indian references that are unique to India’s past and culture - I counted 49 unique techs and units throughout their home city and general techs available to them.

The Lakota have 12.

They might be stereotypical or incorrect or just weird interpretations of India’s history, but there was a concerted effort to reference India’s past and incorporate it into the game.

There was no effort done for the Native civs.

ADD: Again, note that all 12 of those were added with the DE, and most of them were added with the recent Lakota mini-rework. Prior to the newest update, there were 3.

ADD2: It’s not about “make them more accurate to history,” it’s about “make them the Lakota and not just a generic amalgamation of the prairie nations.”

I think there is something wrong with your calculation method, many cards of Indians are common to Asian civilizations

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Then should I also send a request to let the Chinese become a dynasty, not a mixture of Song, Yuan, Ming, and Qing dynasties. Please let the Japanese be a whole, not the Sengoku period and the Tokugawa shogunate, please let the Indians be the real Mughal Empire, not mixed with the East India Company.

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From the tech tree alone:
Brahmin, Sacred Field, Ritual Bovine, Mango Grove, Rajput, Sepoy, Gurkha, Sowar, Zamburak, Mahout Lancer, Howdah, Siege Elephant (this straddles the line), the design of the fishing boat is unique in a historically accurate way, Terror Charge (stupid, but based on India and the stereotypes given), Crushing Force (again, see previous), all the Consulate options are built on Indian interactions with European powers, the Agra Fort, the Red Fort, and Delhi Gate, Charminar Gate, Karni Mata, Taj Mahal, the Tower of Victory, the Keepers of the Rats.

That’s from the generic techs available without delving into the Home City cards.

I don’t think you’re quite understanding what I’m saying - China is a weird amalgamation of the various Dynasties. I get that. I understand that.

But at least they’re Chinese.

Almost nothing about the Lakota civ actually makes them Lakota - I’m not asking to correct parts about the Lakota history in the game that is wrong, I’m asking that they put Lakota history into the game at all.

There are 12 things in the Lakota civ that are specific to the Lakota - Otherwise, there is nothing in the civ that is actually from the culture’s history at all.

I would love it if the Lakota were a weird amalgamation of Lakota history - It wouldn’t bother me in the slightest if the Dog Days were Age 3 and the Tiospaye were the types of military units trained because at least there would be Lakota in the game, and it would be somewhat accurate.

But there isn’t even this base level of incorrectness.

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Why do you include wonder, can you also count the infinite bison, which is also unique to Lakota, and
black arrow ,lakato suppt ,sansarc suppoert ,burntigh suppt ,oglala suppt,nakota suppt,dakota suppt,santee support,yankton suport,earth bounty ,team baffalo hunt,9bison,ogletankavn,onikare, 13bison,great hunter,birch bark,…etc

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I included the wonders because those are unique to India and reference India alone.

The Black Arrow is a Cheyenne religious aspect - I know nothing about it, but it isn’t Lakota.

I didn’t include shipments from other nations because those could theoretically be from any nation. I didn’t include Jat Lancers in my counting for India.

The bison shipments could, again, theoretically be for any prairie nation civ, like the Cheyenne, Arapaho, Blackfoot, Comanche, Shoshone, etc. If these civs were in the game, they could have that as well. So could “Great Hunter,” and the Lakota didn’t actually use birchbark canoes, so that one is just wrong to start with.

Ogle Tanka Un and Onikare are part of the count. There’s only 9 more unique Lakota aspects to the civ, though.

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Instead of bickering with you, I’d rather watch the Kings of the Old World game. Where can I learn a lot of techniques.

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You also forgot that aboriginal tech is partly inside the big button of the building, this is my last reply to this post.

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Zero of the big button techs are specific to Lakota culture. Which is absurd - even the Hauds get at least one that’s unique to the Hauds - Lacrosse was a Haud invention.

If you remember, I suggested a long time ago that maybe look for a name that covers the natives of the plains as the new name of the civilization. It doesn’t matter if it’s simply called Pairie Nations or Pairie Natives.

You said no at the time. Maybe it really doesn’t exist, or maybe it’s because you don’t like it so you pretend it doesn’t exist. I don’t know, but it means we’re missing one of the easiest ways to get things done.

And, it is really unnecessary to calculate the accuracy of the content of the civ one by one. It doesn’t feel very comfortable to me. The point is not whether the accurate content of civilization you care about is more or less than other civilizations, but whether the cost to reach the level you can be satisfied with can be affordable for the dev. Everyone’s threshold for being satisfied is different, and no matter how updated it is, it is obviously impossible to satisfy everyone including you and me, but every update has a burning budget behind it. Don’t forget that we also need the budget to update other civilizations and create new content. Not to mention whether it will still be interesting to the community after the change you request.

So, suggestions are welcome, but requests are unrealistic, and blames are even unpleasant. As for what kind of your complaint is, I think people can judge for themselves.

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I think this is the important part that most people are missing.

The majority of players doesn’t enjoy playing those civs. They aren’t well designed.

We have to ask: How do people want to feel like when they play those civilisations and how can we deliver on it.

People want to play the Ottomans because of big cannons and they get that.
People want to play the British because of Musketeers and they get the best ones in the game.
People want to play the Aztecs because of iconic units like Eagle Warriors and Jaguar Warriors and the Eagle Warriors are on of the best unit in the game.

So why do people not want to play Lakota in particular?
They are one of the most unique civilisations. They are the equivalent to the Huns in AoE2 which are quit popular.
No houses, strong cavalry and now even movable buildings!

I think strange mechanics like the Community Plaza and the Tribal Marketplace are what puts people off.

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I am more interested in the civilizations of South America for example, Mapuches, Brazil, Argentina and maybe the Guaycurú, but I see no problem in adding more native civilizations in the future. :slightly_smiling_face:


Perhaps the natives should be represented before and after the arrival of the European empires.

Age I: Before the Europeans.
Age II: Before the Europeans.
Age III: During the arrival of the Europeans.
Age IV: After the arrival of the Europeans.
Age V: After the arrival of the Europeans.

This would mean having to balance the native civilizations so that they have a less restrictive economy in the long run and at the same time better represent their entire history during the arrival of their new European “neighbors”.


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I can confess to you, I actually quite like the gameplay of Lakota.

I don’t think the Community Plaza and the Tribal Marketplace are so-called “strange” or “weird” mechanics. They’re just another display of the developer’s creativity. Just like Livestock Market is unique to African civilizations, Revolution is unique to Western civilizations, and Consulate is unique to Asian civilizations. They are all the developer’s creativity, and at most you “personally” like it or not. I can accept them, and I’m sure some people like them. It couldn’t prove that they are the cause of the unpopularity, or even that the Lakota are really unpopular. That’s a ranking, there’s always a bottom. Maybe people don’t dislike the Lakota, they just preferred other civilizations. Of course, you can think about how to update them, like changing the name or skin, whatever. But you must think twice when it comes to the essence of the mechanics. People who like the essence of existing mechanics don’t necessarily like new ones.

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