Now with the Lithuanian boost I feel more comfy with them, but after seeing a lot of complaints and rants on the SOTL video about Leitis being viable in Thrash fights (Even asking on a elimination of Lithuanian Paladin, which I really hate since it feels fantastic as an incentive if you collect all relics), I smeel that if it continues you will probably make a huge change on Lithuanians (Removing the real strenghts of this civ), so please the only reasonable small nerf would be a samll increase on gold price, but the rest is ok.
5 Likes
Considering lithuanians are less then 50% winrate right now, I doubt we need to worry about them getting nerfed.
2 Likes
I hope too, my lithuanian preference just increased a bit since the update.
2 Likes
Frankly leitis are too food heavy to see common use in the castle age as is? So most the time you start with trash or knights and then transition into them in the imp age
1 Like
Maybe a more food expensive, like 80 food 50 gold.
So the unit becomes less viable for the castle age time, but still viable at imperial age.
1 Like
Currently they are too strong. They have lower win rate because many immediately want to transition into leitis with the civ and this is easily countered if you spam pikes or halbs.
At least the relic bonus needs nerf, perhaps +3 max.
I still don’t get how SOTL could miss the fact that if you’re spending gold on Leitis instead of siege you’re going to be unable to push anything 11 Oh, and the fact they are never going to be cost effective against halbs anyway.
You realize the +4 bonus isn’t 100% guaranteed right? That +4 is a reward for people who planned ahead and got the relics desoite the enemy’s efforts to deny them.
5 Likes
what is your proof they are too strong? yeah they beat most melee units head to head, but they lose to archers due to their weaker pierce armor.
people at the highest level are failing to play them properly because they want to tech immediately to a 70 food 50 gold unit in the castle age, you totally got it right. people who have played at that level for a long time are all of a sudden failing to understand fundamentals of the game… do you understand why this argument makes zero sense?
or you can wait until we actually have proof that they are OP, which we do not have.
exactly, its uncommon to end up with 4 relics, and anyone at the highest level is going to know right away the smart thing to do is to deny Relics against Lithuanians, so getting 4 with them would be even rarer.
3 Likes
Which other civs has such an overpowered buff even if they plan ahead? And it is not entirely planning. Due to map generation, random factor, you might immediately find 3 relics and you only need to fight for 1.
Even with +3 their paladin beats every paladin on game maybe expect Teutonic at that point.
This bonus is sooo luck dependent so i think is already balanced. Remember, you have to scout relics and your enemy will know you will go for them. And imagine you are agains Burmese.
4 Likes
Is easier to deny the relics to your enemy rather than wait and see how they become supreme over you.
+3 attack sounds much more like Khmer Battle Elephant (Arbitrary nerf on them, just 21 attack when before DE only War elephant had +1 attack over them). keep the bonus as is.
1 Like
If you lose 4 out of 5 relics, then it’s not the civ
3 Likes
What is the problem with Lithuanians? They were weak so they got a buff, if you nerf them again they will return weak…
Letis is just a better version of knights vs meel units, while weaker vs range units. I do not see a big issue
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It is better version of knight for the smaller price. The same as Keshik (Keshik is even more extreme)
Except they can’t be massed well in castle age, require a castle, and are worse against archers.
2 Likes
Castle age Leitis have same pierce and HP as knights but yeah harder to mass
2 Likes
I was thinking about elite though which have less pierce armor. And yeah. 70 food each. Good luck with that while trying to save for imp
I think lithuanians are poorly balanced right now. Leitis is too cheap and cost-wise a bit too strong, but the civ overall still feels weak in most situations.
I personally would like to see the lithuanians get the last infantry armor upgrade for infantry, have the tower shield technology changed from +0/+2 armor to +1/+1.
A wish of mine (though I think many will disagree with me) would be to see the relic bonus changed a bit. Have the relic attack bonus cap go back to 5, but remove blast furnace from the tech tree. This promotes even more a very aggressive style of play to get the relic, without the bonus being too strong as it was before.
2 Likes
You realise this is just an overall nerf? You might as well make it +3 relic instead of that. Like 5/5 relics on a 1v1 map is impossible as is, and even then you’ll get a worse effect than the current one after all the struggle. And this also further nerfs their halbs and Hussars because they miss on blast furnace.
I think the current relic bonus is balanced already.
4 Likes
because you arent understanding the maths behind it… whatever resources you would have spent on trash, can be sold and turned into the gold you need for the leitis… (and thats whats so bad about the leitis’ low gold price)
AND THEN the gold that you wuldnt have spent on trash in the first place is still spent on siege… WOW maybe SOTL WAS actually right… who woulve thought…