Everything will be taken differently in a balance perspective when it comes to unit stats and counters. Since this is an RTS, they can’t just make jans beat everything as that would cause balance issues. Heck spearmen historically also weren’t a cavalry counter, they were an all-around unit. Many civs like Poland used light horsemen as a counter to spears for example.
The worst thing you could say about ottomans is they are relatively uninspired and lack diversity in their implementation (overly reliant on military academies). The civ itself is currently extremely strong. HRE had a similar issue where their landmarks were just extremely OP so the civ wasn’t allowed other nice things. Now that Reignitz/Swabia has received nerfs as well as relics, they have room to get new things or buffs elsewhere.
I dont think jan should beat everything. I just thing they should fill the same role as handcannoner on the counter thing, with maybe a slightly improved bonus against cavalary but just a small one. They would still die to mangonel and be less cost-effective agaisnt archer.
Military academy aren’t that much of an issue, i think its important to keep the civ core design otherwise they would need a whole rework of the civ which is probably not possible for the dev. They could reduce the blacksmith / university bonus but i fell ike it would just revert a previous patch.
I think a fix on janissaries would be easier to implement and would make cavalry more viable and help with balancing without a huge rework.
I dont say jans should beat every thing, they should be main bulk of the ottoman army like maa in the Hre. In feudal jans should use archer and swords. In castle they should use handguns. Some vizier points are useless they should be changed to flavor the Ottomans. Current Ottoman meta arent useful, every ottoman game is same, they are all boring.
It’s pretty intentional that units don’t change weapons (other than aesthetically for some upgrades like HRE maces) between ages. It’s the same thing with Onna-Musha being far from just mounted archers. Tbh, jannisaries arleady have such an identity in strategy games that they will always be gun/cannon units in every game just like how spearmen are always anti-cavalry units even though that is not perfectly historically accurate. Same thing with how Man-at-Arms were frequently not infantry sword/shield units either (in fact Men-at-Arms were almost ubiquitously mounted warriors).
In age of empires 3 Jans use swords and hand guns which is historical. In age of 4 jans use even handguns when enemy engaging close combat with jans. This is so absurd. Jans also handgunners cant use handguns while having close combat.
I don’t think changing weapons is that much of a stretch since the stretzy already do it.
I think they must keep their gun as main weapons. I wouldn’t be against them having a melee attack that is good against cavalry. While their range attack has no counter bonus and is more like Handcannoner (but less damage and faster attack speed)
I would even make it a switch attack like the desert raider (it works very well on them).
This would make the micro much more important and you wouldn’t immediately destroy all cavalry that aren’t even engaged with you yet
That would be one option, otherwise they could go with a MAA replacement that was a melee janissary (better name needed) kind of like how Japan has mounted samurai as well as regular samurai.
The issue with that is that janissaries need to feel unique compared to regular handcannoner. If they dont remove the bonus damage on cavalry on ranged attack then the original issue isn’t really fixed.
Yes, I think that the HRE is the worst of all… all the other civs got new UUs and have more than 4 UUs, however the HRE continues with its 2 measly UUs (the prelate who buffs units and the landschkenet that you don’t see until imperial and above, is very weak)…
I do use the Wynguard palace, that is, I’m not going to limit myself to units for another keep…I think the English are fine, but 2 more UUs wouldn’t be bad either…
Yes, originally in the alpha, the units had melee attack, but they decided to remove it to make it more like AoE 2… I don’t know why they removed it?..
You can still use the Wynguard Palace after. I´m just saying that it is too sad to see English having 2 really cool unique units, that never see any play (in high elo / tournaments), due to its wonder not being useful at its current state. Also, for example, other civs like Delhi or Abbasid, whose Man-at-Arms are not unique either, have better stats and perform better with all ups than English ones in late game. For comparison, use this website: Explorer – AoE4 World. Them being better should not be the case, because Delhi and Abbasid focus on other (unique) Units like camels and elephants. Do not get me wrong, i do not mind Delhi and Abbasid having good Man-at-Arms, my point is that English Man-at-Arms feel underwhelming in late game compared to others. Therefore, Wynguard footman would make a perfect late game Man-at-Arm for the English. Keep in mind that those units will only unlock once you reach Imperial Age, meaning that there is no chance to have those strong Man-at-Arms / Rangers earlier!
I do have to contend with the underwhelming MAA point. English has some of the best MAA, and their MAA (along with enclosures) is the biggest reason why they are so frustrating to play against in imperial.
Big issue with Wyrmguard units is that their other landmark is just really strong and it is hard to compete with Berkshire. The Wyrmguard units are actually pretty good but they suffer from having a good landmark option and being made in batches (meaning they don’t produce when you are at 200 pop)
I get your point in terms of spamming MAA in late game and i do agree, that English are really good at keeping production up and being able to spam MAA easier than other civs. The problem is that spamming MAA is kinda predictable, so most or good players will prepare for that and go for counter units (hand cannoneers, crossbows, knights etc.). So if that is the case, and you run into that with your MAA, you do not have any other great option left since English do not have another powerful unit that can hold the line. Therefore Wynguard Footman would do the job > high hp, good attack > sustains.
I mean the issue you run into with English MAA is facing against mass crossbow or handcannons. Wyrnguard footman are pretty terrible against that as well. If you go for Wyrnguard, the goal is usually the rangers. 9 range 18 attack units are pretty bonkers.
A bit, but with the 2 less ranged armor they end up being only worth about 2 MAA, and due to being locked behind a landmark you can’t mass them in large enough numbers to be a reliable frontline which is the other issue with the landmark. (it takes almost a minute to make 6)
Eh, they would need pretty heavy nerfs for that. If the Wyrnguard units were trainable from the barracks/archery ranges at current price, they would be super busted.
While they are imperial units, they are probably stronger than the current Ozutsu, the difference is that Japan’s other landmark is garbage. Heck the Wyrnguard units have an argument to be the strongest in the game.