they don’t have twice the HP.
40 vs 60. stop spreading misinformation.
True but they still have 150% the HP
And the ability to evade arrow fire. And 25% more speed (calc it if you want). All at 1/3 the weighted price (=66% Discount)
Thank you but I will choose FU Arbs and Siege only for my precious gold. And my food goes to 3X THE NUMBER OF SCOUTS. Which do their job just as good as Shotels for much less.
And at 3X THE NUMBERS, far better of a job collectively (Lanchester’s Laws)
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also. according to your logic in this post.
the fact that Shotels 2 shot villagers makes them better then light cav.
No because as I explained,
LC have have 150% the HP, more PA(till mid Imp), the ability to evade arrow fire, 25% MORE SPEED, AND COST 1/3RD THE WEIGHTED PRICE.
Got it this time?
not double though. and they end up with less pierce armor overall. which is another false claim you made.
and to offset that, they are made much slower (i can make 7 shotels from 1 castle in the same time 7 stables can make 7 light cav) and the shotels do more dmg per hit.
weighted costs only matter if you are out of gold.
But why buff them?
- Celts stronghold is a nice tech that belongs to a civ that is already strong and balanced.
- Italians silk road make your trade so cheap in team games, it let you save a lot of wood and gold and it makes your trade less susceptible to raids.
- panokenson and manhouts correct the main disadvantage of two powerful units, their purpose isn’t to completely cancel it, just to alleviate it a bit.
- mandripur cavalry is now strong than ever since masonry don’t deny it anymore, and Arambai shred any building.
- shatagni and arquebus allow the already innacurate HC better hit more targets.
Greek fire give the bizz the best fire ships in the game, backed by a one dock tech tree, and you want to use it to buff their already strong castles. - orthodoxy allow your monk to most likely convert knights or CA by making them more survivable.
- I can’t see what is wrong with tigui, it boost a lot your defenses for your late game eco.
- howdah and chatras could be tweaked around a bit, but both viets and burmese don’t need any buff right now.
- royal heirs could cost a bit less, but it’s not like it have a prohibitive cost, and it have a powerful effect.
- carrack it’s a naval tech, I don’t see why it should affect OG, that also wouldn’t use the MA since they have the minimum range, and being a siege units it already don’t take that much damage vs archers.
That being said, there are some UT that need some changes, royal heirs can cost a bit less, atheism need a complete rework.
Nomads for Mongols need something too, but we have to consider that the civ is already one (if not the) best civ in the game, I think that maybe it could make Mongols vills to instantly build houses (aegis speed or close to it) combined with its current effect, so that it’s less likely that you get housed from castle age forward.
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but that wasn’t your logic back when you were tring to nerf the Leitis. the Paladin was easier to mass, had more HP and more Pierce Armor, but you swear up and down that the Leitis is superior in every regard.
With the gold heavy Ethiopians, you know you will be. In Mid-Imp. So you have to plan ahead if you’re a good player, and save your gold only for the units which deserve it.
So yes, while on paper weighted price shouldn’t matter, in practice, a good player will use it as one of the biggest factors.
LCav will STILL be 1/2 the price if you weight Gold as Closer to Wood and Food anyway.
so 2 light cav can kill a worker in the same time a shotel warrior can kill a worker.
shotels are more population efficient and have better pierce armor overall.
shotel 50 food and 35 gold, 16 second creation time with 1 castle, with no heirs or conscription.
2 light cavalry 160 food, 30 second creation time with 2 stables.
In the Leitis’s case, they are BOTH cheaper and more effective in all tests than Paladins of other civs.
So better in every way except that Leitis need Castles.
But In LCav vs Shotels, LCav are better in practically every way,
be it in HP, Speed, Unit Cost, Building cost, Pierce Armor, Massability, Gold Saving for long term and evasion of arrow fire.
They even dish out as much NET damage as Shotels, because of having 50% more HP, more PA and 25% MORE SPEED (i.e. chase villagers faster, meaning more frequency of hits).
And then after you get through all those factors wrap your mind around the fact that you can mass 3x or 2x of them depending on your proclivities of spending gold. And how much you value gold.
In my years I have learned to value Gold very very much.
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against paladins. but against archers? Paladins fair better.
except creation time, hits to kill, population efficency, pierce armor.
except you’re not right about pierce armor.
and massability? so you’re telling me Ethiopians, with their crappy cavalry which doesn’t have the final armor upgrade or bloodlines is going to drop 7 stables per castle? i doubt it.
building cost?
50 food and 35 gold for 1 shotel. 8 seconds max, or 3 seconds minimum.
80 food for 1 light cavalry. 30 seconds max or 22.5 seconds minimum.
I just told you , and I repeat again, that LCav have 2 more PA until you are in Mid Imp and have the costly Plate Mail Armor upgrade as the Archer heavy Ethiopians
And even then, on top of all this they have 50% more HP and they evade all arrow fire when moving Tangentially (if you micro well)
They evade even if you don’t micro…
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so you can say its better “in mid game”. but you’re just making the claim its BETTER OVERALL.
really? show me a video of light cavs evading enemy ballistics arrow fire, without micro.
go ahead.
also.
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That would be a relatively more wise decision than going for Fast Castle Shotels because you will have a bad time in the rest of the game if you go Shotels, with a lot of gold down the drain on those frail units
Which do not get many hits anyway
But both these strategies are bad (even the LC one) with Ethiopians, which is why Ethiopians go Archer->Xbow->Arb 100% of the time
As I explained, using all the gold on Arbs and Siege
Therefore, it is never wise to use any gold on Shotels, unless you need few units right there and quick
Which is exactly what we see happening after the Honeymoon Period with Ethiopians for the first few months after African Kingdoms release
+Halberdiers
We never see useless warriors
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so ethiopians who actually build infantry because they get solid pikes and halbs nad free halbs, so they actually get armor upgrades.
is going to drop 7 stables per castle, and actually invest in horse armor upgrades, purely to raid?
yeah okay parthnan.
we have seen them in tournaments, so don’t say never.
As I explained in my earlier reply, it is never wise to use any gold on Shotels, unless you need few units right there and quick
Which is exactly what we see happening after the Honeymoon Period with Ethiopians for the first few months after African Kingdoms release
Yes, BacT made them once in BOa2 ane failed.
Siege Onegers, Siege Ram, Bombard Cannon, Torsion Engines, Arbalest >>>> Shotels
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so you know better then the pros. got it.