Re-work proposal for the Argentine revolution

Age of Empires III: DE III - Discussion
1

It’s no mystery that revolutions are seeing a surge in popularity, this is partly due to the French revolution and I think many players would be happy to have better thought out and balanced revolutions. This is why I want to propose a reworking for my favorite revolution.

image

As soon as we use the revolution, several things should happen.

  1. We lose access to mills and plantations, but we gain access to Haciendas.
  2. The settlers are replaced with gauchos, who for all practical purposes should be horseback settlers. (The gaucho is no longer a military unit)
  3. Argentina gains the capacity to train soldiers to replace the musketeer.
  4. We gain the ability to “Train” cows in the corrals and Haciendas.
  5. The urban center gains an ability homologous to the US state militia system.
  6. all cavalry units are replaced by their consular version.
  7. Increases the limit of cows and sheep by +20 for each Hacienda and +10 for each corral.

Sistema de milicias para Argentina.

Patricios.
During the first English invasion, the patrician regiment was created, a group of militias that was dedicated to defending the city of Buenos Aires and later were fundamental for the May revolution (First national government of Argentina)

I think the patrician could be an excellent addition to the revolution, this militia unit could be specialized in defense and could have a bonus to damage when defending.

Blandengue.
The Blandengues are a mounted militia that were used in various ways, mainly as border guards against raids by both locals and Portuguese.

The Blendengue could be a mounted militia specialized in fighting infantry, artillery and mercenary units.

Note: the militias of the Argentine revolution do not lose life over time.

The dilemma of the mounted grenadier.
I understand that there are many people who hate the current grenadier because it is not historically correct, that is why I want to propose a solution. Let both units coexist and let each one decide which one he wants to use. :slightly_smiling_face:

The Argentine Granaderos card should replace the common grenadier in the artillery foundry with its mounted version and enable the training of consular Gendarmes in the stables.

Infernales.
The infernales were a group of elite gauchos within the army of Caudillo Güemes, they were fundamental for the defense of the country and defended northern Argentina against several Spanish invasions.

This unit could be a mix between a mounted guerrilla and a garrochista, being effective against infantry in general and could be armed with a lasso or boleadora.

Note: I want to point out that all units would cost gold and food, even the horse grenadier who would cost exactly the same as his foot version.

Haciendas Argentina.
All Hispanic revolutions used this building to a greater or lesser extent, in the case of Argentina a counterpart was created focused exclusively on livestock. (The Estancia)

Since Argentina focused mainly on the sale of leather and wool, it wouldn’t hurt to add a card that gives us some gold when we kill a unit of livestock.

Mazo de Argentina

  1. This card becomes obsolete and can be removed from the deck.
  2. This card becomes obsolete and can be removed from the deck.
  3. This card changes its effect, as mentioned in “The dilemma of the mounted grenadier”
  4. This card no longer increases the livestock limit, because the corral fulfills that function.
  5. This card is exchanged for Castrametation.
  6. This card becomes obsolete and can be removed from the deck.
  7. This card becomes obsolete and can be removed from the deck.
  8. This card now sends 8 Infernales.

PS: the revolutionary can still be trained in urban centers, in addition to being able to be sent from the metropolis.

Cards to add to the Argentine revolution.

Military.

Advanced Balloon: Ships an Advanced Hot Air Balloon that remains on the map until the end of the game

Cavalry Combat: Cavalry* get +15% hit points and attack

Spanish Riding School: Cavalry get +10% speed

Milanese Arsenal: Ships 1 Arsenal Wagon; Arsenal upgrades are 50% cheaper and provides Arsenals with Flint Lock, Paper Cartridge, Military Drummers, Pillage, Professional Gunners and Trunion

Liberation March: Infantry, cavalry, and shock infantry get +5% speed and -35% train time. (This card’s effect does not stack with Fencing School and Riding School.)

Economical.

Usury: Lombards now return 25% more coin for each invested other resource.

Economic Theory: Villagers, Fishing Boats, and Caravels gather 10% faster.

Barbacoa: Haciendas automatically gathers up to 2 fattened livestock in a radius of 16 at the gathering speed of 8.0/s; Cows fatten 25% faster when tasked to Haciendas.

Fulling Mills: Villagers gather food from herded animals 300% faster.

Textile Mill: Villagers gather coin from Estates, Rice Paddies, Fields, and Haciendas 25% faster; Haciendas auto gather coin 25% faster.

Rendering Plant: Fishing Boats and Caravels gather food from Fish 30% faster and coin from Whales 25% faster

Silversmith: Villagers gather from mines 20% faster; mines last 20% longer

New cards.

Diego de Mendoza/Corpus Christi combat: Hero-type units gain +100% health and damage; Barracks, Taverns, Lombards, and Galleons can now train Landsknecht.

Buenos Aires market: Cows and sheep give 50 gold when killed; Maritime trade routes give +100% resources, but do not give more experience.

Argentinian Estancias: For the rest of the game, Haciendas generate two cows every 120 seconds and Corrales generate two sheep every 60 seconds; cattle fatten 15% faster.

This is my general idea, I hope the developers like it enough to be implemented. :smile:

I clarify that my version of the Argentine revolution is designed to have a strong economy that supports the new units that are generally quite expensive in resources and population.

2 Likes
2

I think this will be disadvantage. Haciendas are large and cumbersome and cannot be built before the revolution.
It is also unclear from your words whether access to the pens will be lost.

There is no need for this. Haciendas are already making cows.

I can’t say anything about this.

Perhaps, but it is not necessary.

In fact, everyone uses Argentina only because of him. And this is a design mistake. The Mounted Grenadier is superior to Hussars and Lancers because it is much more effective than them and performs the same role on the battlefield and is much cheaper. This makes the card for reducing the cost of melee cavalry completely useless. So it becomes unclear how to use San Martin in this situation.

Gauchos are full of glitches. Their attack is not displayed and sometimes appears as a shot. I don’t see any need for their slow attack. It’s unclear who needs to be slowed down there with the mounted grenadiers. First, they need to be given normal weapons. Without annoying glitches.

Yes, I completely agree. For a revolution without imperial troop upgrades, an economic buff is needed.

The weakest point of all Latin revolutions is that you simply do not have time to increase the required amount of supplies for the normal number of livestock. It would be nice to change the livestock increase map or move this function to something else. But I am against such radical changes. I would do it faster and easier. Each cattle pen increases the sheep and cow/llama limit by +5.

So you want the extraction of gold from livestock to be the same as that of food? (2.0)

I don’t agree with the other theses, but I’m too lazy to comment on them.

3

We will have to wait until they put Brazil and Argentina into a South American post-colonial DLC for both revs to have a rework…

4 Likes
4

Mounted Granaderos should have a attack handicap with their ranged grenade like attack against Cavalry.

5

Yes, but they allow the villagers to shelter, they can be cheaper with a card and they can receive shipments from the metropolis.

Note: The corrals are maintained, I specify it later.

The haciendas produce them for free but only if we configure them for that, in this case that is a disadvantage, that is why I suggested that they can be “trained” or created automatically regardless of how the Hacienda is configured.

Note: The last thing is with a card.

If there is a problem in the prayer, let me know, this is translated with Google Translate.

Note: I don’t know English.

To be fair, Argentina is a Cavalry Revolution, it would make sense for it to have some bonus in that regard.

Furthermore, in some way we have to compensate for the loss of the gaucho as a military unit, the new cost of the mounted grenadier and the new units such as the Soldier and the Cuirassier.

The San Martin card is designed for the competitive, it requires the player to prepare 2200 gold and reserve a shipment, the idea is to use it for an initial push, similar to the one the Chilean revolution has when preparing hussars with the increase in age and of shipments.

Regarding the horse grenadier, I like it, it is not historically correct, but it serves its purpose. I suppose that with the changes that I propose the unit could receive changes to accommodate a more restrained role, after all, the current Argentine revolution cannot be sustained without this unit as it is.

And what does that have to do with my proposal?
The current gauchos would cease to be a military unit and would be a unique version of the colonist for Argentina.
The infernals would be mounted guerrilla units, which are capable of fighting both at a distance and hand-to-hand.
The space left by the current gauchos would be occupied by consular dragoons.

Note: If you are bothered by an error in the unit, there is a section where you can report the errors you find.

I’m glad you agree. :smile:

Maybe Argentina could have something similar to the pastures they implemented in WOL? They could increase the livestock limit based on that building and give the Argentine revolution some unique technologies.

No, what I want is for the cattle to give some gold when they die, maybe 100 is a lot? Would you think 50 gold for each unit of cattle we kill would be better?

6

The current grenadier is what it is because the revolution needs this unit to make up for its weaknesses. If you really want to weaken this unit you are going to need to give it something to compensate for this loss.

I love your optimism. I hope we get one or two DLC focused on South America and the developers bring us Argentina, Brazil, Mapuches and Guaraníes.

7

We have all NorthAm countries that became independent during the timeline. It’s only fair we get all SouthAm (AND CentralAm) countries that became independent during the timeline.

Also

¿cuántas civilizaciones tenés, pibe?

1 Like
8

Oh, I didn’t finish writing. I wanted to, but fell asleep. At the moment, if enemy troops attack the Argentine economy, they will run into a crowd of the best reitars in the game. I wouldn’t want to change that. Outlaws are already heavily neglected in this game.

9

Again, good to see optimism here, but there’s no way in hell we’ll get a dozen civs in South America, let alone post-colonial civs.

3 Likes
10

Hey, don’t be discouraging others, it’s better to be optimistic than to give up on the idea and have it become a self-fulfilling prediction.

Unfortunately I have nothing to object to, the outlaw units are very much in decline, but I don’t think it is up to the Argentine revolution to resolve that, unless you want all Argentine units to count as outlaws. :man_shrugging:

11

Después de casi 20 años añadieron mas civilizaciones europeas. Tengo la esperanza que antes del 2050 tengamos Sudamérica completa

1 Like
12

Cheeky Lunfardo card that buffs Outlaws tho.

13

Son cambios muy drásticos, a mi me gusta Argentina como es. Pero me gustaría que le den la posibilidad de crear haciendas o que tenga alguna mecánica diferente con haciendas. También me gustaría que agreguen a los Patricios, se podría modificar la skin de los revolucionarios para que sean los patricios, o la de los escaramuzadores. El uniforme de los patricios era fantástico.
image

14

¿Alguien me puede decir de dónde salió ese screenshot de los Patricios en el Age?

La he visto como una docena de veces y aún no sé de qué mod salió.

15

Ni idea, yo la encontré en el foro también

16

I dislike the mounted Grenadero at its core design because while they were a real unit they didn’t through grenades (different from the standard grens who did). But if we’re going with this silly design it would have been really easy to balance if the devs would have just gone with a simple design—make them a Grenedier that’s fast. I know mind blown.

2 pop, light ranged cavalry, siege unit, 180 food(?).
High hp, 30% rr,
Attack a bit lower than grens age 4 with the same negative multipliers.

Being Light ranged cav skirm will counter them as they do normal grens. Cav will counter them as they do normal grens. Artillery are the only kicker but that’ll be offset by goons doing better against them then they are against grens cause of the lower RR.

17

Someone’s personal mod I believe.

18

A spear attack can also be…

Of course, you have the 2 great federal post-colonial civs of North America (USA and Mexico), now the 2 of South America (Brazil and Argentina) are missing…

1 Like
20

Es mía, Yo hice esos Patricios al enterarme de la historia del batallón argentino que derrotó a un ejército inglés, y ver que siguieron siendo parte del ejército, tener imágenes de la época y ver su viabilidad para ser creados en el Age.
También como para intentar hacer un mod que dote de Revolucionarios únicos a todas las civilizaciones sudamericanas, pero como me detuve un rato de “la moddeada” (por falta de tiempo) no lo subí.

1 Like
21

I like the unit, it is not historically correct, but it is fun to use and in the end that is what matters about a video game, but as I said in “The dilemma of the mounted grenadier”, I think the best solution for this controversy, is to give both units to the Argentine revolution.

The mounted grenadier goes on to train at the artillery foundry and costs the same as a normal grenadier, perhaps even adding a negative multiplier against cavalry, but in exchange it gains a little more base damage.

Meanwhile the Argentine revolution gains the cuirassier/consular gendarme as a guaranteed unit, all its cavalry is replaced by the consular version, and it gains some new cards to compensate for the fact that it is no longer a food-only revolution.

The Argentine revolution does not have any card with that name.

Call me a Güemes fan, but if Argentina one day becomes a complete civilization, I would be upset if it wasn’t mentioned on a card when Güemes boarded an English ship with cavalry units or that his guerrilla tactics were extraordinary. :smile:

Que lastima, yo todavía sigo esperando con ansias ese mod. :disappointed: