They were together temporarily. For most of their medieval history, they were separate. That’s why they’re separate civs in AoE2.
They were unified early on when Rurik, a Kievan, was invited to become the leader of Novgorod. If the legend is correct, no conquest happened, as it was a peaceful unification. This was very early on, so for most of their medieval history, Ukraine and Russia were the same. Thus, their being represented by one civ is more correct than being represented by two, as they were essentially never separate during the AoE2 timeline.
You are confusing different princes altogether. This unification of Rus’ with the Vikings was relatively peaceful (although not entirely, they were first kicked out and then called back). And Novgorod’s campaign against Kyiv was military! You can’t tell the difference between Rurik and Oleg the Prophet.
I don’t get it for the reason that it is incorrect. You don’t know history. You are an American, and I am Russian, and you are trying to explain to me the history of my people, which we have been broadcasting since childhood from every iron. They broadcast in different ways, often with propaganda, but I am an adult, educated, and I have learned to distinguish it. I support not just the freedom of Ukraine, but also historical authenticity. I don’t deny that we have a certain common period of history, but that’s all! All nations have it. America was under British rule, so what now? Japan was a Chinese colony. Sicily is the land of Italy. And this can continue for a very long time. But for some reason you have no problem recognizing them as separate, but here you are stuck. You need to understand that you are using double standards. And you do this because you really just DO NOT WANT representation of these peoples. That’s the same way you hate AI because it takes your job. Apparently, the Slavs also took something away from you.
Yes. The Kievan Rus came from an intermarriage between the Vikings and the Slavs.
I’m not. I use the same historical standards for the Rus as I do for everyone else: if they were the same people, referred to by the same term, then they don’t need to be separate civs.
That’s not true at all. I think the Kievan Rus are cool. But they were one people during the Middle Ages, referred to by one term, and thus should only be one civ. Plain and simple. I don’t know why you aren’t getting this. This is history that is available everywhere, and yet you’re disputing it.
I hate basically all technology, because it’s leading to the downfall of humanity. But that’s neither here nor there.
Not true. Not true at all. The Slavs have done nothing to me. I even have a Ukrainian friend who speaks Russian. So I have no bias against them. I believe in actual history, not propaganda, not fairy tales. Real history. The same real history I have been trying to convey to you.
Caucasian as in from the Caucasus? No. Caucasian as in white? Of course.
Then ask him and show him this talk. And listen to what he gonna say. I am sure he will say that we have some common history but he will not accept your point as it is.
Real history is Ukrs are totally different people with different lang, look, moral, architecture, culture. And they were occupied by at least 4 sides, Rus is just one of them.
Sure.
Lithuanian princes: Vitovt, Olgerd, Jagiello, Svidrigailo. Ruled Western Ukraine.
Crimean khans: Mengli-Girey, Devlet-Girey, Sahib-Girey. The Crimean Khanate was an independent state that controlled most of Crimea and influenced events in southern Ukraine.
Hetmans: Bohdan Khmelnitsky, Ivan Vigovsky, Pavel Teterya, Ivan Bryukhovetsky. Hetmans were military and political leaders of Ukraine who led Cossack troops and fought for the independence of Ukraine.
Rulers of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth: Stefan Batory, Sigismund III Vasa, Wladyslaw IV Vasa. The Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth was a confederation comprising Poland and Lithuania, and ruled over the territory of modern Ukraine.
Galicia-Volyn principality: Danilo Galitsky, Lev Danilovich, Yuri Lvovich. The Galician-Volyn principality was a medieval state that included part of Western Ukraine and part of Belarus.
For Ukraine generals ARE rulers. Back in the days it was a really military land.
If they are not Ukrainian but Polish… so… does this mean that Ukraine is the same as Poland?
Now name me 10 Burgundian rulers. I mean, they are in the game already but were they really kings of independent country?
I am really interested in what he gonna say. Tell him that there is a Russian who supports his side and I will be glad to see him in this discussion if he has such opportunity.
If not, then you can convey his words, but you must do it honestly, without changing his text.
I am probably partially a viking too. Russians have that part of blood.
Yeah anyone wanting peace will agree that they are same people. It’s sad how lives are being lost on both sides. Anyone wanting to fight will try his best to nitpick differences.