And I would like to point out that the Vikings have the worst cavalry in the game.
Maybe the history part could be solved if the tech also converted barracks into something else, visually and name-wise.
Google would suggest “Kenjutsu” as a name for place to train to be samurai.
Swords are overrated as f**k, Spears and shield or Axe and shield can be way better, specially because swords are harder to Master
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maybe dont rely on a 5? 6? year old video
let me introduce you to our little friend the burmese champion(i picked em because you dont need any UT, you just train them, but there’s a number of various civ champs that eat samurai)
our friend the burmese champ, even beats lith paladins (with up to 3 relics) cost effectively… im sure the same applies to aztec, or some other champs… but burma does it the cheapest
unfortunately the samurai is nowadays more of a gimmick, and thats why a lot of people have been asking for buffs for it… even if it belongs to a boss tier civ…
history part never needs to be solved, as long as you can justify it balance wise and it isnt too much work for the devs, then it fits the criteria for almost everything else in the game, or do we need to make that insane list of historical errors across aoe? starting with meso siege
i bet japanese champs beat samurai quite handily. don’t get me wrong +3 attack is nice for burma, but 33% faster attacks?
according to the sim, burma does it better, but japanese champs are still a close 2nd
Actually i tested this once, champ vs champ for each civ to know which one has the best champ, in different numbers of units:
1.Japanese
2.Aztecs
3.Bulgarians (not really champs but their 2h beats all from below most of the time I tested it)
4.Burmese
5.Vikings
6.Teutons
7.Slavs
8.Celts
9.Generic
Notes:
-Vikings and teutons are a very close one.
-Slavs (expected more from druzhina in bigger groups but is very inconsistent due to the pathing but actually beats bulgarians consistently in bigger groups or stacked fights, others like vikings doesn’t beat bulgarians)
-From burmese and aztecs there is a +1 attack difference but it matters a lot.
his test was champ vs samurai though.
yeah there’e quite the selection. and vs each other its nice to see japanese are the best, but in the larger groups, when pathing works, slavs should almost always win.
but even after all of that, malians have arguably the most useful champs since they dont have the same hard counter as everyone else
also wondering how cheap this total tech is now with the discounted BS. i know on wiki we can see the old total, but havent bothered working out the new total, must be by far the most cost effective to tech into for outcome?
Going back to the samurai, I disagree that they are good unit. They used to be situational before DE, now I don’t even see them at all. The damage bonus against UU is way too gimmicky, especially on a melee infantry unit that often cannot even reach the target before dying. Elite upgrade is also very expensive for what it gives>
I feel like elite samurai could use 1 extra pierce armor to be somewhat resilient to arbs…that would help making infantry pushes actually possible with japanese.
I don’t think it would make japanese too strong, as it would only help them in the late game, where they are already kinda weak past the arbalest power spike.
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Samurai are the only unit that has bonus damage against both konnik forms, it must mean something Kappa
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Aren’t samurais countering the most (number of) units in the game?
BTW I’m pretty sure that the poor elephant archers are countered by the most (number of) units in the game though.
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Ballista Elephants are also countered hard
That’s theory. In pratice, most of the time they still are defeated by archers. Japanese halberdiers are already the best halb to counter cav in the game so who needs samurai to counter cav UUs. Cataphracts? those die to Japanese FU arbs. Probs worth dealing with konniks and infantry UUs the same way.
So in the end they are pretty good to deny a Goth player who likes huskarls a lot ig? But even then the spammability of the Japanese champ makes it an easier option to do that.
Also: Viking Elite Berserks utterly destroy Sicilian Elite Serjeants. THAT is why Berserks are still great infantry units. Go to 21:46 of this video to see the results:
ELITE SERJEANT vs UNIQUE UNITS | Post-Imperial Age | Sicilian UU | Age of Empires 2 - YouTube
i’m sorry but if those videos panned out even slightly in game ETK would be the best unit there is.
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They are somewhat legit when comparing melee units I suppose? Ofc there are still problems, mostly that having exactly same numbers or same ressources on both sides is really rare.
Samurai is just fine, but far from decent. If samurai has faster movement speed(1.2), it can be good.