Siege Engines and Italian Artillery

Leonardo’s Tank

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The tank designed by Leonardo da Vinci is pure fantasy and does not belong in the Italian unit roster. It could be a fun unit for a campaign, challenge, or cheat code, but it shouldn’t be something available in regular gameplay.

There is a precedent for a semi-hypothetical unit in the Sebastopal Mortar but in that case, it was actually built, just not used in battle. However, there are many more issues with Leonardo’s Tank. It was never actually built and the design had several flaws that would have rendered it inoperable. It also predates the game’s timeline with a designed date of 1487.

Cortez’s Trebuchet

When it comes to archaic meme units, Cortez’s Trebuchet is by far the best option. During the siege of Tenochtitlan the conquistadors were running low on gunpowder and decided to build a catapult as a way to conserve gunpowder. Gameplay wise, it could be a one time shipment for an age 2 siege unit. It could function like a Culverin since the only thing it was effective at destroying was itself. A Culverin equivalent wouldn’t really be overpowered in age 2 and it could give Spain the option to commit more to age 2 aggression and still have a counter to Falconets from an opponent’s FF. It could also count as an archaic unit for the Reconquista card.

Ribauldequin

Ribauldequins would be a much better option for a Renaissance siege unit based on da Vinci drawings. It could also kill two birds with one stone, and fix Portuguese inaccuracy by transferring their Organ Gun unique unit to Italy. There isn’t really evidence of them being used in Portugal, but they were used by Italy, France, and England.

Swivel Gun

The Portuguese would be compensated for the loss of Organ Guns by giving them a Swivel Gun as a new unique unit. Many Asian countries adopted this type of artillery after it was introduced to them by the Portuguese. These would be functionally similar to Organ Guns by being less powerful than a Falconet, but more mobile and quicker to fire.

Italian Bronze Cannon

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With these beefy cannons, Italians shouldn’t have to worry so much about the drawbacks of Ribauldequins/Organ Guns.

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Nah I want the tank. It’s fun and unique.

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Me too, it could be a card. Wouldn’t mind a trebuchet either.

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I too believe that it might be a cheat unit.

If it’ll be a serious units, it’ll probably be some special HC units that can only be shipped in few numbers, and that have a niche use.

In game it might work similarly to a gating gun.

I don’t really see what this has to do with the italians… or even with spanish since the treb miserably failed…

The portos can still have the organ gun, and the Italians can get the ribaldequin.

The problem is that if the Italians would have such unit, it would have been probably present in the screenshot that we got… it’s not impossible though that they get some organ guns shipments.

I’m not sure if that’s will be a standard unit or just a reskin of the lil bombard.

I mean, it only changes the color of the bombard, so I think that it’ll be just a mercenary/special unit. It’ll probably be shipped from the HC, maybe with an HC shipment that allows to train them at the saloon.

It might be though their factory unit.

Overall, I think that the Italians artillery roster will be quite simple:

  • Petards

  • Falconets

  • Culverin

  • Mortars

  • Heavy Cannon/lil bombard

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No reason to give italians the organ gun, they didn’t really used them, although they had some, which were also smaller than the french and english one…
Even the Leondardo one was just an experiment, if there is anyone that should get them is either french or british…
These try to give italians the organ guns are tiresome, if people don’t want ports with the organ gun because they think it is shiz is fine, but to give that to italians make no sense, just make it a merc and solve the problem without having to pass it to another civ…

I agree it would be best as a mercenary. The problem is that it seems like they’re committed to a da Vinci theme with the Italians. If they’re going to do that, I think a Ribauldequin would be a much better option than a fantasy tank.

If their big bronze cannon is available in age 2, Italians also wouldn’t really be disadvantaged by Organ Guns the way the Portuguese are. The bigger gun could provide the anti-building damage and tankyness that Organ Guns lack.

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If they’re going to add siege engines from the early 1500s I’d rather it be something that actually existed, not something that’s just fantasy.

Yeah ok, but why add a treb to the Italians when by the 1500 they actually really used gunpowder weapons effectively.

I get that you may not like the Da Vinci tank, but a treb seems onestly even more crazy in a game that revolves around gunpowder.

Also, trebs were more of a siege anti-building unit than a anti-artillery unit.

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I’m not advocating that, the treb should be a one time shipment for Spanish only.

An age 2 unit that functions like a mortar would be way too strong. Making it anti-artillery would give a niche role for evening the playing field versus age 3 opponents.

In some accounts of this particular trebuchet it self destructed, so it destroyed at least one siege unit. Treb wars are also a thing in AoE2.

Ahh ok… still designing a completely new unit just for a one time funny historical fact sems a bit too much…

Not fort their anti siege properties…

Touche

At least in this case it would be historical. The tank was just a sketch of a machine that had so many design flaws it wouldn’t even function.

Jokes are tolerable on scouts, but not on units that are supposed to be metagame.

I know there are people who like it, but personally I like that the game is taken seriously and with historical truth.

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What the scouts have to do with it?

Just as there was never a spacesuited explorer, there was never a war tank before the 20th century.

He means Explorer skins

Leonardo’s tank could function as a German war wagon, strong against the infantry, weak against the culebrins… the trebuchet of Cortes would be rare, but it could function as a 2nd age mortar type for the Spanish and the ribadoquin could be a regional unit for the Portuguese.French and Italians…

The tank appears almost hidden behind the cathedral, like peeking out in a funny way, just read the context, it’s not something to be taken seriously…

Leonardo’s tank is absurd and unrealistic, but so is having Japanese fighting Ethiopians in Texas. I think it’s fine to have an unit based in a ‘what if’ scenario in history.

As for balance, I expect it to be ridiculously slow with a very weak attack with poor range, but high armor and HP. Completely impractical, like the real thing would have been, but quite a sight on battlefield.

Leonardo’s tank appears in ac brotherhood, so I don’t see it as weird to appear in a game where you have gatlings camels xd…It would also attack like the organ guns but instead of being a frontal attack it would be an attack in area firing everywhere like the Hussite wagons…it would be a way to replace the Portuguese organ gun and would be unique to the Italians…

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I think the devs are just trolling with the tank. Doubt it will be in the game.