Slavic, Turkish, Vietnamese, and Portuguese Balance Suggestions

Age of Empires II: DE II - Discussion
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Ok, well, first of all, this is very much a “prototype idea” not really fleshed out, as i want to see what you think, that being said, don’t turn this into a warzone please!

Slavs are powerful, that should change
however the boyar is not doing a good job at replacing the paladin

so my suggestion is to take away slavic cavaliers (very flawed as it is rn)
(i didn’t want to take away bloodlines or an armor upgrade which would hurt the hussars)

what do you think about this? i already see the flaws, so i want ur advice to flesh it out :slight_smile:

another idea is to nerf their farmers (as i believe we want to nerf the slavs)
and make the boyars more food intensive, thus the boyars would seem more streamlined with the slavic eco, or just make the boyars train faster

another idea is for the Portuguese, this is probably a bad idea though, it is to take out feitorias, then give a much smaller trickle to tc’s, this isn’t really fleshed out however, Portuguese are anyways very powerful in more closed maps

for the vietnamese sotl said their problem is being one dimensional, assuming that is true, to fix this i say we give them free bloodlines ad husbandry, but that might be too powerful, free cav armor upgrades may work though

note: some say the vietnamese are just hard to play, in that case no need to buff them

lastly turks, everyone wants to give them trash, but that ruins their identity, if u want to buff them allow them to kill the enemy before the gold runs out, that means
a. make their gold last longer (cheapen units or buff gold pile res)
or
b. give them more powerful units
i like the idea of making artilery or spahi train the units 2 times as fast
someone suggested to increase the gold mining bonus, that way they end the game quicker, not sure about that but it thought i should mention it
another way is to make spahi affect light cav

feedback is appreciated!

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You should think in the whole design of Teutons and Slavs

Teutons focuses on slow but armored units and their bonsues make sense

Slavs are that type of aggresive civ and Boyar makes up for their heavy cavalry which the Slavs lack.

Is better to no touch that civs right now, both are completely fine.

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how would this make their castle age too strong? and frankly i don’t know why everyone is so up in arms over unique units, most games aren’t lasting long enough to get to unique units with new Arabia
you’re literally nerfing a weaker civilization (teutons) to buff a stronger civ (slavs).
also you literally just nerfed Teutons for no reason and took them from a mid tier civ to a below average civ.

how are we going to balance this? are TCs going to start taking up pop space? how much of a trickle?

not a fan of this at all, britons are one dimensional and are one of the best civs in the game. as are franks.

this seems like a huge overbuff.

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Vietnamese are an archer civ, not cavalry civ.

To be honst there are much better and balanced ways to buff turks.

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thanks for the feedback

slavs are on the better end of the spectrum, but i guess it would be better to attack their eco

however boyar time and time again hasn’t been chosen over the cavalier,

knight v knight battles, melee armor comes into play

also i had o idea tuetons were weak, sorry about that

i just think that with all the limitations of the boyar, it should still be better than even a tuetonic paladin

idk, which is y i was asking you, (forgot about the feitoria pop space when making this) is there another way?

i guess so, however Vietnamese are on the lower end of the spectrum. i was thinking of their elephants

3x? idk, but just an idea

i was thinking they have bad cavalry so it would only help elephants

just an idea

thanks for the feedback anyways :slight_smile:

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6

true, but right now you don’t see teutons dominating do you?

how often do we actually reach paladins in 1v1?

also still not sure why you are buffing SLAVS of all people, and nerfing Teutons.

Portuguese are a conundrum because they have so many options available to them.

not sure how you think they have bad cavalry. the only buff i would give to their cavalry is buffing chatras.

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i didn’t know tuetons were weak, if they are, they probably need a more fitting bonus

also, i’m talking in general, not just 1v1

to be fair, i did try to nerf slavs (with no cavalier) thought that might be too extreme

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what’s more fitting for a slow, defensive, grind it out civilization then more armor?

you buffed their castle age, and their unique unit, but cost them the cavalier, which comes in during imperial age, which doesn’t see much use in the meta now.

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Not sure what’s happening with the people aftre looking that the once bad civs (Goths, Khmer, Teutons, Lithuanians) that are now stronger and solid then all are scared due to their good perfomance and want them back to the worthless side, just look at reddit and there are a lot of rants about Goths.

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well slow means less cav in my opinion
i think more hp is taken
need more ideas

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goths and teutons are only good on the ladder. Teutons aren’t really making their tournament present known except on arena style maps. Goths exist merely to annoy archer civs.

they have the slowest cavalry in the game, bar none. woad raiders literally move faster. and they always were a hybrid civ on cav/infantry/siege/defense.

start by not nerfing teutons, not sure why slavs need buffs. they are at the sweet spot of being used enough to have a solid presence, without the need to nerf.

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12

well i mean…

you do make a point though

ya i guess i’ll just delete the MA thing

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13

Why we have to give such techs free for Vietnamese? They are archer civ not Cavarly civ.
Also, many civs are also one dimensional and they are good as they are. I think Vietnamese have more flexibility than some other archer civs such as Mayans or Britons. They have Bloodline/Elephants and Bombard cannon.
Also many pros regard vietnamese as a solid civ (above average). They are not bad, just hard to play.

I think just increase their gold mining bonus like 20% to 25% is fine. It makes them mine gold faster and make their great gold-intensive unit faster and end the game before game go to trash war.

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you make good points, ill edit the vietnamese with a note, but im not sure about the turks, will add a note anyways

thanks for the feedback :slight_smile:

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I think the boyar is a powerful unit. Id just make their training time shorter so they could be massed easier.

Portuguese is a hard to balance civ as they are much better water civ than they are on land and a strong bonus could make them easily OP on water.

Turks is another hard to balance civ for so much time now. If anything I would have sipahi tech apply to theit light cavalry line. This would keep their identity but will make their only trash unit better. Mass hussars are one of the possibilities to counter arbalest if you can surround them and outnumber them at least cost efficient. Also turks are more or less a CA civ. Improving the CAs in general should work for them,too.

Honestly I think Viretnamese are at a good spot balance wise atm. They have design problem where the imp skirms, uniques units and even normal archers perform roles too similar (anti range range units).

2 Likes
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okay thanks for your feedback, i’ll add some notes

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I like your ideas with turks. On the other hand I dont think slavs need a nerf. In fact I think they are a very balanced civ nowdays so if you take out their farm bonus it will take out the idea or identity of the civ making it useless as portuguese, turks and italians are today

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no taking it out, only nerfing it

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slavs don’t need to be nerfed, or buffed. they are at the sweet spot as is and should be left alone.

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20

Just compare Bulgarian civ and Turk civ.
Bulgarians receive FREE about 800 resources ( 600 food and 200 gold) for upgrade of Militia line.
2) Bulgarians save (receive) 50 stone from every towncenter built.
3) Blacksmith work 50% faster. That is very poor bonus. Very rarely it may be useful. Even at 100% faster, it is poor.

Ot the other side are the Turks. They are only Imperial age civ, and at the the time of Aoe 2 they were just Noobs compared to Bulgarians. They are included at Aoe 3 and there , the Turks are very powerful.
But at Aoe 2, the Turks receive Bonus from Dark age.

  1. Gold Miners work 20% faster, from Dark age.
  2. Light Cavalry and Hussar upgrades are free. So Turks save 1300 resources ( 650 food and 650 gold )
  3. Chemistry is free. Turks save another 500 resources( 300 food and 200 gold)
  4. Gunpowder technologies are 50% cheaper. Turks save another 500-1000 resources at Imperial age.
  5. Gunpowder units( Hand cannoners, Janissaries, Cannon galleons) have +25% HP and Gunpowder units are created 25% faster.

So the Bulgarians save about 1000 resources for the whole game, while the Turks save about 2300- 2800 resources and have powerful gunpowder units, who are created faster( every unit, and not just several researches at blacksmith) and have 20% Gold mining Bonus from Dark age…

And you say- the Turks are weak ??!!!
I say- Remove the Turks from Aoe 2 and put them only at Aoe 3 !!

1 Like