I don’t think that we can put the Italian archers on pair with Britons, mayans or Chinese, and they don’t have anything on the other units.
Think about the games 1v1 on Arabia.
Even ouside of Water they neutralize Cavalry and Gunpowder civs entirely.
Not every civ is an Arabia civ.
It was an extreme example, and they should at least be decent. Also right now other archer civs counter cavalry way better.
God is too much to ask that their UU is on pair with other civs.
They do have the weakness of being slow on land maps. Of course all civs need weaknesses and it’s 100% fine.
How are they slow?
They Age Up fast due to it being cheaper, and have decent Cavalry.
I agree, I only think that their slowness aren’t properly reward at the end.
Cheaper age up doesn’t speed them up that much, faster gathering rate really speeds things up. Watch Mongols, Britons, frank, slavs, Aztec.
Now if there is water Italians have a great advantage, I admit it, and I’m not saying that thay need some other economic bonus or be a top tier Arabia civ.
They just need some tweaks in order to be on pair whith other civ on pure land maps, so if I pick a random game with a random civ and I get Italians on a pure land map I at least have a chance.
Theoretically cheaper age up makes you go faster, but it’s one of the worse bonuses for this, and is only good when you can use the fishing ship bonus to have a faster eco.
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Well, some other civs like Portuguese and Turks are just as slow, so it’s not like Italian are the only bad land civ.
Yes but turks and porto are powerhouses when they get there, and turk have a faster gathering rate for gold which helps a lot.
Plus free light cav upgrades and a gold discount helps them.
Also both janissary and organ gun takes 21s to be trained.
I don’t think that an organ gun is on pair with a GC.
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Well, first the Condotierro makes Italian a civ win vs those two. Both Port/Turks bonuses are on the weaker ends of eco bonuses, just like cheaper age up. Only free Hussars stand out but you don’t even need massed GC to deal with those.
Too bad Condotierri come out of barracks, and train in 18s.
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Yes in imp, and they get trashed by champion, knight and archers, but I get it. The problem is with the GC, check other UU training times.
How?
You have GCs, FU Skirmishers, discounted HCs, Arbalests with Pavise, Cavaliers and FU Champions.
Except that Condioterri are better than 2HS, which means the enemy will be forced to upgrade all the way up to Champ before getting a fighting chance, and with the time they will need to FU their infantry, you will (hopefully) have an army of armoured archers or discounted HC to kill them.
Well, there are other examples, like Mangudai taking 26 seconds, but since both units are good it’s fine.
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Mangudai is a cav archer, and it takes only 4s more, i compare the GC with longbow, chukonu, rattan, janissarys, plumes.
As for condos are effective only if you have a really big mass of them, otherwise crossbow and a meatshield are more than enough to counter them.
Because if I upgrade everything I will be always behind my enemy. Condos are effective I rush and surprise my enemies, how I’m suppose to have HC in early imp, and I can’t mass GC.
No, they are better than 2Hs and almost as fast as Eagles.
But they cost less, and they are still counter by knights and crossbow.
I guess you are just bad at the game.
No two ways about it…
Maybe you are right, never stated the countrary, but while I have my opinions, right or wrong that they are, I never judged you, so please express your opinions about the games and suport them with sources, but limit your contribution to that please.
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