Solution to make india more played in treaty

Caroleans + Leather Cannons are not the Skirm + Dragoon combo he mentioned.

The question of wood can be discarded depending on the map

Sure, but even on this, you are forgetting some crucial elements:

  • Gurkhas might be slightly better than Skirms, but the later have many more cards to upgrade them, including Advance Arsenal. The MAXIMUM bonus Gurkha will get in late game is 15% HP and attack via 2 cards (+ 1 card mandatory to get Counter-Infantry Rifle).
  • As they have the same base training time, Late Game Skirm will be produced, at WORST, twice as fast as Gurkhas.

That leaves the Gurkha with what, 1 extra range over a Skirm? But less speed, HP and Attack?
What is the strategy exactly?


They still demoslish Skirm + Dragoon.

Oh come on man, you know damn well that Skirm + Dragoon mean an army that have a splash of Dragoon in it to deal with cavalry that could counter Skirms. No one is talking about sending waves of Dragoons against Gurkhas…

The question was OBVIOUSLY how to counter a mass of Skirms protected by Dragoons.

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Gurkhas will handle the Goons, a few Bombards will murder the Skirms.

I am 100 % sure that JonOli is a troll at this point. Everything he says is factually false. Siege elefants better than culvs or morts? they cant even outrange forts.
Ghurka better than skirm? Just no, they have worse stats, even against civs without good cards.
The only saving grace for india atm is that they got popefficient mansabdar units, but everything else is just mediocre


I play treaty with India only, and have played alot, and to be honest the Original demands feels right at start, but after the decrease of siege ele population to 5, and Sepoy imperial age at 60percent things are more reasonable now.

Although a lack of canon is something that u learn to cope up with, but the DPS u can achieve with canons is no where comparable!

Sepoy become a little useless in treaty TBH coz no one uses mass musks in mass fight that much! everyone has skirms ! some have canons too!

Meanwhile the one thing i will wish for India in treaty is Longer range!! While all other civs have mortars /Culvs with range 40 and 34. As India, u canNOT hit anything/unit/building beyond 30 range (just to point out,that too in imperial age after age5 Siege ele upgrade)

Out of all! this is the suggestion I liked the most ! but the thing is ! it can be used to block the map hence a very good but impractical untill a limit of 2 groves at a time is applicable or something, but that will nullify the infinite card it self, so i hope u get the point there.

Only Japan and India gets the Ports consulate, meanwhile for Japan port is is exploitable for age up and shrines! but for India its good for less wood cost of walls/gates/barracks in treaty. But a for a wood heavy and wood rich India its not a big issue.

So IMO I preffer a Dutch consulate as they also had presence in India. and faster unit production will help although it shouldn’t allow for instant troop creation but a minor unit creation boost will help.

My suggestion would be to add 5th Civ in consulate to all asians, because all europeon civs have a consulate option, but in DE thats not the case for sweden and adding dutch to India and sweden to other might add something new to asian civs which usually dont get major mechanics change

Gurkha have only 1 more range than Skirm, but inferior attack and HP against royal guard skirms

SADLY THATS MOSTLY TRUE! the problem with Indian units is, they are jack of all trades but master of none


  1. those are siege elephants, so the name describes they are good at siege!
  2. Culvs have tremendous 34 range , while siege ele have 30! for comparison, the cheaper flaming arrow have 30 range and same damage against artillery, and better against infantry so it functions as falc+culv, and for siege japan has 46 ranges mortar! while India has 30 range culv+mortar and no falconet like canon

Urumis are good against samurai/Halb Charge! but that has its own limitation also! U cant depend on urumi for too long, and that too get slaughtered by canons and cav


Finally 1 comment for someone who understands me


And that point I want to go, to add something like the cannon why I suggested the Russians at the consulate to get heavy cannon or wood

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Sure, it’s so easy to train a 60 second army that cost 2300 export, monopolize 27 population space while being created and can only be done from a unique building that can easily be sniped… (also Consulate need villagers and cant be built by Sepoys like the other ones).

The point you seem to be missing is that, yes Indians might have access to most options, but they get many of them in a less efficient way than many other civs.

Keeping in mind we are talking Late Game/Treaty, even if all Indians units were better than their European equivalent, the huge difference in training time make Europeans civs able to counter and trade more efficiently than Indians.


Just to show how huge the difference is, here is a quick exemple.

A Musket army approach the Indian city.
The Indian player react by building Gurkhas while the European player anticipate with some Hussars.
By the time the first Gurkhas are created, there will already be 10 hussars in the battlefield (from only one stable) with 5 other coming just a bit after the 5 Gurkhas!

FYI: Hussars are created in 6 seconds VS 16.5 for Gurkhas in Late Game.


the saddest and losing for Russia only they train 100% faster having inferior unit

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It’s hard to balance India in treaty play without breaking it into 1v1 guys, we should think of something that works in both 1v1, TEAM Games and treaty.
In itself, they are already quite broken in 1v1, I reserve a comment for a treaty, because I do not know


truth, plus the options that I put in the post are for long games or games of’'rushs ‘’ with more than 20 minutes will not make big difference if they but in specific ages

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I agree there. Specially considering the direction the meta is going towards.
Supremacy games have been getting longer and longer now days

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For India to be a better treaty civ! some of its units need to be master of what they do! India have all types of unit but none of them is exceptionally strong when u compare pop wise.

With that strat, any decent player would beat u seven times, with seven different civs, 100% guarantee u wont win a single game with it!

Didnt want to point it out but, I seriously see it :rofl:


Funny times. I remember trying to talk balance in terms of treaty games to a community of 1v1 players… xD

Oh the backlash.

But yeah, I rarely ever see people play India in treaty. And the times I have, I usually played Russia, where infantry training time was never an issue lol. In the open map, the Indian player would build have to build a buttload of fast barracks and train sepoys from there, but as Russia, I only needed one blockhouse and some stables to counter it all, and some oprichnick flanking on the side xD

India does need a training time buff in lategame… And the WOOD problem… omg. So many civs in treaty need a decent way to get wood late-game. I do concur

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I’ve tried India in Treaty a couple of times and struggled with the same issues you’re facing. Overall not a great eco, with a lack of a building that allows for an automatic generation of recourses and training time is rough. Both Japan and China got either a factory or something that replaces a factory so I’m not sure why India shouldn’t get something similar.

Though, I’ll be honest I haven’t played India much. Perhaps there is something I’m completely missing and maybe they would turn out completely broken if they did receive something like a factory.


Agreed. I’ve played India once in treaty and I just couldn’t stand the awful training times. You see a swarm of hussar, and damn, you could grow a beard trying to pump out all those sepoys, lol. There’s such a drudge feeling of inflexibility when you play that civ

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