Well, this was the strongest civ before Asian Dinasties. It is grossly OP, in my opinion, and has better Cannons than all Euro civs.
India is heavily carried by Sepoy, which are OP, and Vills costing Wood, which lets you save Food for units and Age Ups very effectively.
It isn’t. Japan is the most OP civ in the game, by far. Has the best Musks, better Heavy Cav than most civs, mini-Zweihanders in their Samurai, a wealth of insane upgrade options, a Bank, a Factory and a Church, amazing Shrine economy, Golden Pavilion with Euro upgrades and a Global bonus, Daimyos that can train gigantic armies by surprise while away from the Town, decent all-rounder Artillery, double explorer from the start for hyper-efficient scouting, and a bunch of economy cards that accelerate their gameplay early and often.
The title of this thread is “spain still the worst civ”. So this thread claimed that spain are not balance, so this thread talk about balance so can i ask you to just leave this thread because you are not here to talk about balance.
@Shneider177 Data are collected from EP elo (since 2017 to 2020). Spain vs russia, 55% winrate on EP (and spain is better now, where russia is almost the same)
This is real cool that ep pick up this tool!!! This the stuff I like!! I use to get a version of this off aoe3.jpcommjnity.com but yea. EP spain is much better than RE I definitely wasn’t on here saying otherwise. And I agreed that Spain is fine on most maps in 1v1.
Ep spain vs russia is slighted favored for spain? Music to my ears!!!
Ahhh here is the big confusion I think. Me and Amphipirion have been playing on ep (very different to RE where, you are correct, spain suck!) for a longgggg time, with very very similar balance to DE. As Spain lamers we know that Spain has been good for a while and that they arent " the worst civ in the game", arent 1 dimensional, dont have a 39% win rate etc. I mean if spain werent good we would be the first people to be asking for buffs haha! I tried to tell people earlier that we all have our own preconceptions after a few games but with spain theres already so many streams and videos of them you can see how they are good, different ways they can be played but if this is not enough I am happy to help.
Also im in terms of my rank id imagine im pretty high considering the population of DE. I mean i won 9 out of 10 of my ranking games playing spain in differnet ways on different maps, the only game i lost out of the 10 was because 4 vills got stuck in a tp at the start of the game which I have screenshot proof of haha! I lost two games versus the best player in the game on his stream and other top players like GUA and youre correct im no where near as good as them, but defintely high enough to see balance!
On the other hand Amph is a very very good player right at the top, so fair enough if you feel my rank isnt high enough for balance I suggest you read his points on what has been suggested
since most of this thread revolves around the Spanish gold card … what if:
-move the card to age 2 but its effect remains the same. It could give you more slots for other cards in fortress and you could send it as your last colonial card while aging up. It should not ship coin if you stay in Colonial, only when you get to Fortress you can get coin through shipments
-or leave it an age3 card and make it give you 600c in the first shipment so it has a more inmediate effect, and then 400c per shipment
I think the Spanish are pretty solid. Maybe Rodeleros could use another buff but otherwise, I’m happy with just Spanish Gold + Logistician stacking, which can be potentially powerful if used right. You don’t even need to ship resource crates as you’ll get them with every Age 1 card. (except Improved Buildings for some reason)
Speaking on rods it does peeve me when cheaper heavy infantry units beats a rod in straight hand to hand combat… also peeve me in the same way when a comparable unit in cost beat rod significantly in hand combat caroleans…
Rod use to be…
Imo should return to being that heavy inf unit you DO NOT want to run into hand to hand combat with they qay caroleans are now. Rod currently have too many counters and only really punish cav units if they can get a snare and or a surround…
Here is a lwgit idea that would not devastate the balance. Swap some of the bonus mulitplier against cav and shock inf with base dmg. For example start rod off with a base dmg of 17 melee attack but make cav bonus 2.25 and 1.5 bonus vs shock inf. This wohld keep all the multipled totals the same vs the units rod SHOULD counter yet a 17 base attack would give rod the carolean treatment and ppl wohld run from us!!!
Now spain could care even less about shooters!!
Standard musk vs rod would result in a rod winning assuming the musk could only get off 1 shot before melee commenced leaving the rod with only 26hp, which of course scales to the rod disadvantage in a mass vs mass due to pathing and inefficent concave and or saturation into the heart of the enemy mass.
Edit
I just added all the spain ups for Rod and base 17 even with a swap in multipler is too high… so let’s do 15 or 16 base attack with multipliers adjusted for same overall bonus totals.
Would be so broken lol. At the begining of nilla, rods had 13 atta and it was too strong. With 16 atta your rod are good as hussard at raiding but so much harder to contest.
Yea 16 might be too high but what’s wrong with 14? And adjusting the the bonus? At base 14 a rod would kill a standard musk with 14 strikes and leave the rod with 2.8 hp assuming the musk got off one shot prior to melee. And they would still lose to caroleans decisively…but it would be less devasting than current.
Rods seem fine? who’s manz is this!!!?
They are “okay” but they could benefit from some attention. Especially in teams. How much of a problem would 10hp added to base be???
That would amount to 2hp more in fortress upgrade
Then 4hp more in industrial ups
And 5hp more in imperial ups
A full upgraded with church and advanced arsnel rod would be have 406 hp in imperial
Current full up is 378hp … 10 base hp can change our rods life late game but would not break the early game.
At base 10 additional hp we could kill a musk that shot us once before engaged melee. And why shouldn’t we kill a musk that we cost more vil sec than if they can’t kite for more than 1 volley???
At full up we’d stand strong in a mass vs mass war soaking triple rifle shots as we shred thru the front lines!! 406 hp 40% mr 26 melee 3.5x bonus 5.7 speed…
Aight to reiterate . Rods cost more villager seconds than a musket. However in a head to head matchup the musk has the edge over the rod if the musk can get one volley off prior to the melee Mashup. In a straight melee to melee its a toss up on who wins. I would like, just like it is for caroleans, a melee to melee of rod vs musk imo SHOULD have the rod winning decisively!!
who’s manz is this!!!?
… 10 base hp can change our rods life late game but would not break the early game.