Spanish rework concept

This is assuming that the same tech tree is used.

Civ bonuses:

  1. Fletching line upgrades free (requires Blacksmith) → balanced by no Crossbowmen, justifies naval tag. Weirdly also helps them with CA rush.
  2. Houses and walls constructed 50% faster → defensive bonus for FC build orders
  3. Knights, Cavaliers, Paladins when killed resurrect as Man-at-Arms, Long Swordsmen and Two-Handed Swordsmen respectively

Notes: Researching swordsman line upgrades does not change this behaviour. Ex: researching LS does not make Knights resurrect as LS. These foot units also do not benefit from Arson or Tracking. The upgrades they benefit from are Infantry armor upgrades, Squires and the obvious melee attack upgrades.

Team bonus: same


  1. Inquisition - at it is
  2. Supremacy - Gunpowder units fire 18% faster (includes Conqs)

Other changes: Conqs fire rate increased from 2.9 → 3.45 (same as Hand Cannoneers). Basically the bonus instead of being embedded in unit stats, is now seperated. More of a bug fix.

When going CA with this concept, you ensure that when switching to Conqs, you already have all upgrades.

what good are (possibly unpgraded) militia in castle age?
or maa in imperial?

why do you think spanish need a rework?

It’s still free value, also they kill spear line just fine. Also won’t call them unupgraded since you can get Blacksmith defence and attack upgrades.

You are probably correct, so I should just bump them up a tier.

Bunch of bonuses which do not add upto anything.

As an official cavalry civ, what bonus do they have? Builders being 30% faster is the most useless bonus ever, and is used only for Trushes and Castle drops.

What does current Supremacy achieve?

Except they arent listed as a cavalry civ

1 Like

are you sure? i’ve never seen militia fight pikemen, so i have no intuition for this. if feel like there might be situations where people will just delete these units. it’s a weaker version of the konnik

that’s true, maybe they should be relabled as a gunpowder civ?

no, it makes them pretty good at nomad, as they have +1 vil because of this. and you don’t want to castle drop them as spanish can counter castle drop and win.

makes it super hard to raid them, allows them to make forward buildings, has good synergy with the faster construction speed

They already are

So not sure what hes talking about


yeah, i was just checking this as well

Eh, I’d like to see some changes to Spanish but these just seem kinda funky, like they were pulled randomly from a bag of leftover bonuses. Fletching line is already gold-free, so I don’t know that they need any more hot, sweaty blacksmith love. Some kind of ship buff might be nice, but I’d really like to see missionaries become useful, and a slight buff to Elite Conq (accuracy, range, or damage). Also looks like you’re making conqs worse until they get Supremacy, which I can’t get behind. Like Hera said, Conqs is basically all they have going for them (and it’s mainly low numbers in Castle Age where they’re good, they don’t scale as well in numbers as Mangudai or Camel Archers).

1 Like

So uh why are they a CA civ now? Like with such a gigantic nerf to conqs and no more castle drop bonus no one is going to bother with conqs anymore. I also don’t get why the infantry units from the third bonus should have no arson? Their gunpowder bonus is also not something worth to be an UT, especially when the Burgundians would get to have basically the same thing done slightly differently but for free.

Among these ideas I’m only agreeing with the second one because it’s pretty much close to what the building bonus should be to be more impactful, something like “buildings are built 50% faster, stone buildings are built 30% faster” would mean they actually get an eco boost from not spending as much time building while not making the bonus OP.

1 Like

Before DE and at the release of DE, most people did not say Spanish was weak. But since DE, Spanish has suffered a series of indirect nerf, like more separated and smaller woodlines, multiple nerf on walls and towers. This hurt their early game. I wonder this may not be the problem of the civ per se but the maps has changed too much and unfavor spanish.

I love these two.

This is not needed. Leave Konniks alone, let them have this feature exclusively.
Don’t do what Devs did to Leitis and the new Urumi civ.

1 Like

That was because conquistadors were nerfed, Spanish were seen as pretty bad even on the guaranteed FC arabia generation we had at some point. Nowadays they got somewhat better with the big speed boost they gave to bullets.

Come on don’t get rid of Supremacy, it’s a fantastic tech! Those vils can take on halbs, it’s very useful in late imperial age!

Spanish shouldn’t be entitled to FC every game on Arabia into Conqs, I’m against this 100%.

this is too much gold and stronger than Konnik bonus.

Spanish are a nice civ, not every civ needs to be S-tier on Arabia, Spanish have their place in the game on Nomad and closed maps, definitely not a bad civ and they have many things going for them including stellar late game, BBC, good water, good UU.

I just want to get crossbowmen so it makes sense to invest in archers in Feudal age at least when the need arises. This has no effect in the late game, but is a big help in games where there is no way to build a castle as quickly as possible.

I don’t think doing so would make them lose their uniqueness, what a distinct identity their conquistadors are, and would make the Bulgarians the only civilization without crossbowmen.

Because the Dismounted form will do more damage than the mounted form.

Paladins have 14 attack, no bonus damage.
2HS have 12 attack, +3 or 4 vs buildings and get another +2 with Arson.

That’s why you get free Bodkin Arrow.

I thought of this bonus around this idea. CA were just cherry on top.

Their Castle and tower building speed has been nerfed. Their Conq attack speed has been locked behind Supremacy.

And also better.

Faster building % has not been increased yet bcz of non-mirror DM I guess. And obviously Nomad but that can be kept as 30% in stone building category.

I’d love to see Spanish be a decent water and hybrid map civ. Maybe an wood bonus?

Or what about this?

Treadmill crane free from Dark Age (basically 30% has been reduced to 20%), but the bonus of 50% faster building houses and walls is also present. So that gives you 80% faster built houses and walls compared to a generic civ, while also having advantages in building TC on nomad, trushing and castle dropping (the latter two also benefit from free range upgrades)

…Because Spanish, widely considered as being in the bottom tier or 2 on most maps, need to have the 1-2 things that they do well nerfed (conqs and trush/castle drop), in exchange for a small bonus that’s centered around units their tech tree doesn’t incentivize…(archer line, cav archer line). Big No.