Make sipahi affect them. xD
But for reals, sipahi could add something to scout line. Maybe 1/1 armor? 10hp? (20 might be too much idk)
Since it’s their only trash unit, it could be a bit more useful even when it already has free upgrades.
Edit: ok it’s not their only trash unit in the sense that skirmisher can sometimes be funnily useful, spear however will never be so.
Steppe Lancers with +40 HP (Bloodlines and Sipahi)?
Would be broken OP, and we would have to reduce the effects of Sipahi to something like +5 HP, which would be incredibly bad.
They already upgrade for free, isch is a respectable saving in Food and Gold. You could actually upgrade Knights to Cavalier and train a few, with those savings, or field more Janissaries.
Yea it was a joke. x]
Yea but at trash wars turks are just useless. Trying to think of ways to improve it without adding new unique units to them, cause I don’t like those ideas myself. :S
How about giving the light cav line extra pierce armor? Like getting +1 pierce in castle and in imp. That would give FU hussars 8 pierce armor, which seems a lot, but it is actually probably balanced when considering the much lower hp of the unit. Moreover in this way hussars don’t become any better against melee units, compared to having an higher hp pool. I think this kind of bonus would fit turks pretty well.
If you want a turkish civ with arrow resistant Hussars then Tatars are for you I guess
Turks are still really strong in team based maps.
Mining faster is a better bonus than extra resources, especially on a civ like Turks which is about having access to gunpowder units faster than other civs. Changing the bonus to extra resources would be a nerf, not a buff.
Depends how you look at it, it would make their gold game last longer, making their trash game start later than others.
But why not both. 
Mine fast and last longer by the same %, so it depletes at the same time as others but you gained much more resources from it. Maybe nerf the speed by 5% to 15% and make them last 15% longer. :>
Its not just their super lategame. They have bad early as well so on open maps they are super dead on closed ones are decent but archer civs can destroy them. skirms or maybe onagers or some new UU will be needed at some point. you could buff them in diferent ways(eco or some military bonus) but that would most likely lead to crushing civs without good counter option while still suffering vs archers.
seems like Turks would be a lot better building kreposts.
How about Turks get Genitour and Elite Genitour instead of Berbers? But not as a team bonus. Feels like only Turks get a lot out of Genitours because Sipahi affects Genitours and Turks have the worst spearman and skirmisher.
Replace Berbers team bonus with “Castles work 10% faster.” by splitting the Kasbah effect. Kasbah adds another 15% work rate to team Castles for the cost of 200 food, 200 gold.
Genitours are an Iberian military tradition, and Berbers already get only because they conquered the peninsula, but not even them should have it (It should have been a Regional unit for Spanish and Portuguese only, since it originates from those cultures).
Turks having a cultural unit from the other side of the Mediterranean, makes no sense. Genitours were not muslim cavalry.
If Turks are facing archer civs, they can make their tanky Cav Archers.
With a very big civ roster, I feel like pro players don’t have enough time to try out different strategies and often they don’t know all the civ bonuses. That opens the field for other players to surprise them.
Hmm so i see you forego Civ balance for History here. Interesting
No, but giving Genitours to Turks would make as much sense as giving Paladins to Aztecs.
Turks are balanced around their strong Gold options.
Berber have Genitours because it was a unit that was supposed to be the original Spanish UU, so people wanted them in, somewhere.
Turks need no other units. Berbers actually need the genitour, becuse they were designed around having it.
Not giving Indians a Melee Elephant would make as much sense as not giving Eagle Warriors to Aztecs.
Indians already have Elephants, false equivalency.
Tell you what, I will allow Turks to get Genitours, if Indians never get BEs at all.
This shows inherent double standards in your arguments.
Your idea of ‘The Meta’ is far too narrow. You need to be open to have some traditions with regard to “traditionally strong civ”, “traditionally weak civ” be given up especially since the player base is growing and most are new. They wouldn’t know the Aztecs/Mayans are traditionally a strong civ and Turks/Portuguese are traditionally worse to play.
Open your mind to more possibilities and dont forego game design just for your idea of the traditional Meta.
On the contrary, you are the one making a case for BEs to be added to Indians, while I say that Indians do not need BEs, and Turks do not need Genitours.
I am against adding any new units in both cases. It is a very congruent position.
Someday, you will face some Turk player that will go full ham on Janissaries + Mangonel. Pro tip: don’t invest in archers you’re going to have trouble winning.
You’re speaking like no one ever in India tried to put a platform on top of an elephant and proceeded to shoot stuff from there. Actually Aztecs could have had no Eagle warrior since they have the Jaguar warrior and reskinned monks. They would suck as a civ, but the game would actually be more accurate since Mayan and Incas would lack it as well.
I don’t get why you would give up your opinion just to contradict people tho
Trust me newbies always played like that. That’s why you can see some dank Elite Teutonic knight 1 TC rushes win games and stuff like that. I can also be sure in many noob games someone (read: several someones) went mass Ele archers, proceeded to win and thought Indian eles are quite cool. Of course we don’t get such a feedback because these players play casually, not to argue here 11
The “Meta” won’t care about a camel civ design being shaken up, after all there is Chinese and Persian for that 11 All jokes aside, not ditching the Ele archer sounds like a good reason imo to not give Indian eles BE. Because even without any fancy bonus, Battle eles are going to be better because they scale better thx to their splash damage, what the ele archer won’t ever get of course.
I didn’t know you were on the dev team and made the official decision on what does or does not go into the game. Suggestions are for everybody. Not just you.