Teutons change: Crusader Knight upgrade replaces cavalier - remove paladin plus other changes and some for a few different civs

Sure i could see that. But I wouldn’t expect it. But crusader units aren’t generic really.

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Giving all the heroes historically accurate looks fixes most of these issues. William the conqueror is still a 15th century knight and archer of the eyes is a white dude with a cross bow wearing 14th century armor.

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Introducing Winged Hussar was a good move into that although it is too powerful compared to regular hussar and therefore both of the civs that have the unit lost some blacksmith techs to balance it. This clearly shows how hard it actually is to replace a generic unit with another.

As for water, I don’t think there is any room to add another generic unit. What will be its role? Countering fire ship better than demo while sucks against galley line?

Imo we should replace the water triangle with a water pentagon, we could add a unit that is strongvs galleys and a new ranged ship but thats weak against demos and fires (like a catapult ship for example) and a new ranged ship thst counters both fires and demos but its weak against galleys andthe other ship

I want more water units simpmy because water is super boring rn. Imagine if land battles were only trash units and bombard cannons

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I like the Idea, but I think water is also boring because there are no sophisticated strategic options outside of military:

No woodlines, hills, walls, garrison, defensive structures, buildings to kill…
No ressource spots or important areas…
And no land transition if you won the water battle.

NO No NO PLease NO!!!

Water towers, water walls and water gates would be lovely. (Fishing ship builders)

It helps their Halberdiers, which allows them to fight enemy camels and elephants. TK’s are a strong melee unit, but they are so slow that even elephants can walk away. And Paladins are a bad idea against either of these units.

Strong halberdiers are also the only good thing Teutons have if the game lasts until trash wars. Their skirms don’t have bracer, and they don’t even get light cavalry.

The champions are less important, since TK does most things better, but it is a nice option to have if you run out of castles and need to counter trash or eagles.

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Nah. I’d rather have builder boats as a new unit, that can also repair ships and possibly docks.

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Right now the scenario editor has stagnated. No new content being added aside from the trade carts.

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You realize that just non-Elite TK mixed with every Teutonic composition can defeat Elephants or Camels. Since when these two counter this civ? It was always CA rather. Especially after the recent buff, all TK need is squires, not even any armor/dmg tech to shred any melee unit.

I dont mind giving their Halbs extra armor, but giving Champs the same +2, drains all the potential purpose of TK.

And my idea to include those units in the scenario editor helps end the stagnation.

Teutonic Champions need the bonus because otherwise without castles how you deal with other infantry and eagle warriors?

Other Infantry and Eagle Warriors?
You have your own FU Champs, on top of a FU Cavalier, Handcannoneers, FU Heavy Scorps, and that’s on top TKs, even a single Castle is enough to make them, since their training-time-per-value is as good as it gets, perhaps the best infantry in this regard besides Shotels. (TK creation time = 12sec, Karambit=6, for example)

In fact TK are so good you dont even need a mono-composition army to use them, unlike Woads or Berserks they have even more value in low numbers, blend them with your Knights or Halbs.

Why everyone thinks that Teutons are bad in this regard, they always crushed other melee civs. Including Eagles. The become helpless against Plumed and CA, that’s the thing.

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Knight line is the only generic unit line that didn’t go through any base stats change ever since AoK (Correct me if I’m wrong). Changing Cavalier+Paladin to another will probably be the hardest thing to balance.

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Wrong. We have gotten bloodlines since then.

Prob only units that havent changed are siege

Not a change of base stats.

Except mangonel and scorpion, arguably rams too as garrison feature was not there back then.

It is a must have tech so I would say that practically it is

My bad. Maybe trebs?

By base stats I consider stats before you have any upgrade or bonus. Guess I should mention that. And also half of the civ still has the same AoK knights.

Yes Trebs and Rams if you consider garrison feature and upgrade cost unchanged.

Upgrading rams required gold in the age of kings, so that’s definitely an important change that happened to them.