I think you meant dart throwing LMAO, but I never heard they wield darts. They did wield bows however.
I think you’re describing Koursores which is the “medium” class cavalry the Byzantines had (they do look similar though). The Clibanarii or Cataphracts are the real tanks of it’s day. They are so heavy and in turn hard to move that at the Battle of Turin, Constantine only ordered his army to extend their line and massacred Maxentius’s Clibanarii after they went too deep into the enemy line (this is the reason as to why I want them to unable to cancel their charge, to simulate how hard it is to maneuver in such heavy armor). So they are actually very weak against spearman line, but almost unstoppable against archers.
Sorry, I got a bit confused writing earlier (and I thought the arrows in the image were darts). I said that about the darts because I think I remember that they were adopted to replace the pillum.
On the part of the horse archers, I would like to see the greatest variety of troops possible, but something makes me think that they would not be included for them in this game, I don’t know why, maybe for the Ottomans controversy.
Cataphracts historically often depicted in scale armor like in the image you posted. And even though scale armor was heavier than European full plate armor, it didn’t provide more protection.
Metal scales unlike plates in the full plate armor are independent pieces attached to a clothing. Because of that
it’s possible for stabs to get under the scales by sliding through surface of the other. Such probability doesn’t exist with full plate armor because it’s a compact, one piece metal. Scale armor also would transfer relatively more blunt trauma damage to the wearer because of it’s structure.
Altough I can see devs ignoring this minor difference considering Chi, Abba, Otto, Delhi,Mon civilizations also mostly used scale, chainmail or plates attached to chainmail(not full plate) as heavy armor historically.
Now that you mention it, it seems the Cataphract in the picture also don’t have Lamellar armor which is essential in blocking incoming arrows. I’m not going to delete this picture (this one is from Pinterest) but I’m going to give another one with more trusted source:
Image Source: https://www.hellenicarmors.gr/en/armor/byzantine-cataphract/
This is one is from a restoration attempt from Macedonian Era 10th CE
but I must agree that plate armor is indeed superior than any armor that comes later in the late medieval and even renaissance period. Lamellar and scales only advantage to plate armor is they are cheaper to make, reflecting both Byzantines troubling finance in the late middle ages and its increasingly powerful Turkic and Arab enemies.
Espero que agreguen a los bizantinos, bueno al menos en el aoe 2 estan y en el aoe 3 hay una mejora llamada “Legado Bizantino” que mejora los puntos de resistencia d elos barcos y edificios un 15% y si es una referencia a su bonus de hp del aoe 2 xd
esa es la pagina de una de las unidades que son entrenadas en la casa de fanár… y da algo de tristeza el no poder escuchar el clasico isvoli xd
Your coment and @Alexios732 coment remerbered me to a documentary about armors and there they give some explications about the superiority of scale mail in many circumstances. Usually i dont edit the post in order to the new ones can read the suggested changes in comments and not as something original of mine, but this time it seemed necessary.
Yo creo que llegaran y efectivamente hablaran griego, Isvoli y otras fraces las veo recuperadas como referencias en las unidades, tal vez también un “Prostagma.”
I speculate… a standing army tax. All military units taxed 10 food 5 gold per minute. Age ups are financed through taxes.
Oh dang I kind of nailed it eh? They mention Tax 13 times in that article, basically saying tax was part of their fiscal culture their entire existence, especially in times of war.
The backbone of Byzantine administration and economy until the fall of Constantinople, relied on the Hellenistic joint tax liability system of the different towns and villages, chora and komai inside a théma, duties which were carried out by provincial officials such as the epoptes, exisotes and praktores. A Theme itself was made up of several individuals and institutions such as the various lands that the many monasteries owned episkepsis, the soldiers farming lands stratiotai, the estates “proasteion” of the land owners dynatoi and the peasants geōrgikē, the later making most of a village or town chora, komai which were the main source of constant and rapid revenue which ultimately derived from the Hellenistic fiscal and administrative principle of “epibole”, that had served as an accessible tool for the Hellenistic kingdoms for the simple income and rapid collection of taxes in the war-time Hellenistic period, being adopted and adapted in the late Roman and early Byzantine province of Egypt which never stopped applying said system, indirectly, a consequence of the multiple wars and invasions that Byzantium had to deal throughout its history.
It was a documentary where they proved the veracity of Chinese references to armor made of paper scales hardened with resin to protect themselves from arrows. The conclusion was that scale mails in general are very good against projectiles.
possibly it was an episode of “inventos de la antiguedad” or “ancient discoveries” in English.
Maybe with the Senate mechanic, some think like that:
Every system have a resource asociated and every minute the town centers generate 50 of that resource (max stack of 5 or similar number).
I found good reference images to the military equipment of the units, unlike the classic image of a simple armored cataphract, the Byzantines kept a classic flavor in several aspects including the military.
are these from MK1212AD mod (it doesn’t seem like it)? If it is, just a little bit warning, the Byzantines unit models from 13th -14th CE onwards are mostly based on little evidence (paintings, statues, etc) and speculations of “what if” since we all know the Byzantines army would later deteriorated to the point of relying mostly on mercenaries.
They are from another mod called The great conflicts mod, and you are right but Byzantinism as a general branch is quite turbulent, much archaeological evidence is replaced by manuscripts, manuals and frescoes on many occasions. In addition, it should be added that most researchers share the idea that certain weaponry characteristics such as the use of plate lamellar armor were quite obvious given their repeated mention in all Byzantine literary fields as well as their exaggerated and almost divine position in Byzantine art that in certain occasions, it is also considered archeology.
After reading this I expanded my search to Byzantine Army in Komnenian Era, where it’s stated that the army’s extreme efficiency (surviving even after Constantinople’s Sack in 4th Crusade) lies on its Emperors. Byzantine Army (Komnenian Era)
Which means Byzantine units should be micro intensive? I still have no idea how to implement it in the game, but I already posted an interesting idea here that’s probably worth noting I think:
Personally, I like the idea, even so I think that the position of a Strategos should have a more important role if we wanted to implement it, but I quite like the idea that as a unit it can speed up the process of certain things or convert units, it highlights its rol.
possible Strategos?
What occurs to me is linking the Strategos to the Senate system that I proposed, this because some administrations such as the Themata and the Exarchates were under the tutelage of a military leader whose attributions and powers changed according to the system.
The drawback is that the powers that the senate possessed were null, the Byzantine senate was essentially the stage in which you could show off your various titles and the closeness to the monarch but without having any real power or task. On the other hand, the real administrative power fell to the military Strategos of each Theme, a Hellenistic system with Seleucid precedents in which the monarch entrusted these governorships to the general “Strategos” in charge with the hope of withdrawing as many taxes as possible from all institutions and individuals and create fast and flexible provincial armies when needed, in addition their minor tasks were those of the basic development of said governorship such as the maintenance of roads, villages and the basic security of the province.
Thats not even close to how or why the Holy Roman Empire was formed.
Also the Byzantine empire is indeed not ancient Rome, but it is Roman, as the term Roman became something else, when the Romans began expanding, it doesnt just refer to the people group, not to mention a lot of peoples were romanized and a lot that was still done in the Byzantine Empire was what was done in the Roman Empire.
There was not as much Romanization as there was Hellenization, the eastern Mediterranean was always under Greek cultural influence, hence the term Greek East and Latin West, there is also a visible difference between the"remains" of an empire with the totally independent advances of a new entity.
