The issues with AOEIV

Age of Empires IV IV - Discussion
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Hello everyone,

I’d like to talk about what I believe are the two most important issues right now that we are facing with this game, and in my opinion if these two things don’t get changed in the near future this game will suffer a lot from it. With that being said let’s jump right into to it:

  1. Lack of communication from the team:

First of all, I’d like to say that I honestly believe that the developers behind AoEIV are really passionate about this game & franchise, and that they are working tiresomely to address all of the issues remaining with this game, while also working on most likely new content (yet to be announced to the community). With that being said one of the biggest issues right now that is affecting this game in a negative way, is the communication or lack there off which is not good. They need to address this issue quickly, and the community manager or who ever is responsible for this in their team need to rethink their working plan as right now it’s not working.

I’m fairly sure that if we had proper communication from the team, the community in large would feel that their worries & constructive feedback are being listened to and that it’s in fact being worked on by the team. This wouldn’t make all the problems go away right away with the game, but it would give out trust to the community which would help to buy time for the team to be able to finally release patches in the future that address those issues. This doesn’t happen of course and need to be drastically improved from their side.

  1. Damaging behaviour from the community

Secondly, before I start to talk about this issue, I want to say that the community is very important for this game, if we want the game to stay alive for many years to come a great community behind it is a must. With that being said, there is however something that I’ve noticed for the past few months that is in my opinion extremely damaging to this game and that is our attitude and behaviour on the forums or Reddit etc.

While it’s very important that us the community provide constructive feedback to the team in order to let them know what’s wrong with this game, it’s also important how we deliver those messages to the team. The following points below are in my opinion the issues here:

  1. Attacking or threatening the developers or anyone in the team that is working on this game. This is not acceptable behaviour and it has to stop immediately.

  2. Toxic behaviour on the forums both to the team & towards other players within the community because of different opinions is not healthy for this game and it’s damaging it.

  3. The constant creation of repetitive threads talking about the same issues over and over again are just frankly not needed, especially when some of those issues are being addressed for example in the Season 2 patch. (Better late than never I know) Here would be better for us to create a single thread that has all of the issues remaining to be fixed and we make sure to update that with constructive feedback, to make it easy for the team to find those issues while also keeping the forums clean.

  4. The community is scaring away potential newcomers to this game, when they see ridiculous topics like “THIS GAME IS DEAD” or “THE DEVELOPERS DON’T CARE” etc. It’s not helping AT ALL, in fact it’s damaging the game even more please understand that. If there are no newcomers, the community cannot expand and therefore increases the odds that this game will in fact die.

AoEIV is by all means not a perfect game nor is it as bad as some of the players make it out to be on the forums, and I think it’s really important here to be able to say that we enjoy the game but also providing constructive feedback on things that we have issues with, that way when newcomers or other players as well come to the forums, they see that we have here a good game, but that has certain issues left to be addressed. This doesn’t scare away people!

We cannot expect the team behind this game to change according to our feedback when we cannot do the same to address the issues within the community. It goes both ways, and I’m pretty sure that most of us care for this game and want it to succeed but in order to do that please start rethink how you write and sound on the forums because that plays a crucial part for the future of this game.

At least this is my opinion on the two important issues surrounding this game.

Let me hear your thoughts, do you agree or do you disagree?

Let’s have a civil conversation below!

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I don’t think a “toxic community” is ever a factor that harms the game. On the contrary it is the result of bad management or handling of either the game and/or the community. The reason one sneezes is because one gets sick and the reason bacteria grow is poor hygiene, not the other way round.

If the game itself has a lot to discuss, either about its current stage or its future, the “toxicity” from the villainous haters or vocal minorities or whatever word you use will be overwhelmed by the “constructive discussions” or whatever you call it. All of us are humans and cannot post 24/7. In fact that is the exact case at the initial release. There were negativities before the release, some toxic, some constructive, but in the first month after the release the majority were busy talking about campaigns, balancing, strategies, potential new updates, even bugs (which is of course also constructive). And there was a whole long “hah you haters” thread claiming triumphant.
Why almost a year later it turned into this current situation is obviously a mystery.

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conservatives always denying the flaws of the game and not demanding a better game that was promised since announcement. The communitty has already waited so much. We already 8 months since launch and there’s no progress of the promissed game because they still fixing the basic or foundation mechanics and focusing only on balance.

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let’s all get up on our horses and knight up. please wake up, if you are happy paying for a product and receiving less than the said product then by all means call is complaining.
I call it asking what you paid for with your hard earned money.

The developer didn’t consult me before setting the price or in what state to release it in (from what i read on these forums, everyone was telling them to wait). So when I complain about the state of the game or why some things are taking too long why is it a problem?

The studio is working on a different game is not my problem, they didn’t give me a break on the price because they would be working on a different game (that makes them more money) and not updating the one I paid for?

The forums is scaring away new people but the ridiculous things in the game are not? the things we are “complaining about”, so the person didn’t get put off by the game but will get put off by people asking to fix the said issues. Mind you this is a person that went to forums after playing the game? I hardly think so, I would think they came to the forums to complain about the issues not making the game fun cuz they overall like the game.

And if there are more topics made then that means there is an issue. Who is anyone to tell someone oh hey 15 people complained about this so go back we don’t need to hear 16th time. That person paid just as much as the 15 prior they have just as much right to make a post and vent or let the dev know of their personal concerns.

Toxic behavior should not exist anywhere but do understand, here, it comes from frustration. I am guilty of saying things in not the most pleasant way but sometimes it gets past the filter, when you are annoyed. I have played DOTA 2, if you want toxic, try that. people venting is not toxic. people attacking personally, yes should not be allowed. but me saying the devs have take a nap for the last 3 weeks cuz they seem to have done diddly squat is not toxic. that is what i feel not having been given any info on what’s going on.

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Who are conservatives? What does that even mean?

Also, what promises are you talking about?

They could improve their communication and maybe their pace, but they’ve been implementing everything they said they would. Look at the patches, almost every single change made is based on player feedback.

The game probably released too early (definitely had too many problems at launch), nothing can be done about that now so why dwell on it. Almost all of the issues the game launched with have been fixed at this point.

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i mentioned in a previous post the definitioon about it and its basically the ones that don’t want a change in aoe4 and retract the ones who want a total rework in the game. happens that they call those people toxic or any similar mean in term of separate them from the communitty.

Yup those 2 ideas is what it should but doens’t happens and as I said the aoe 4 communitty already waited so long that the only choice is to force the devs so they can bring it up. It’s not toxic but an natural reaction when you get something inferior for what you pay.

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there’s nothing wrong in demand a better game for the 60 bucks that you payed (for steam players)

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And you are getting just that with each patch, the game becomes better overall. It’s already in a pretty solid state now, yes should be at the launch of the game but it’s here now.

And Season 2 patch is just around the corner with even further improvements and additions to the game.

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Couldn’t agree more with you.

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Yes, we have payed for a product and we have the right to voice our concerns & constructive feedback to the developers, and we can all agree that they released this game too early but hey we can’t change the past.

The current state of the game is in a much better state today thanks to them continuing patching up the game, BASED upon the community’s feedback so they listen to us and they do care about this game. Saying otherwise is just lies and lies.

Doesn’t matter how it makes you feel, as soon as you start being toxic to the team or other people on the forums for sharing other opinions, you no longer provide valid constructive feedback and therefor no one takes you seriously including the developers.

This is the issue in today’s internet culture, there are no concequences for your behaviour and actions and people do as they please, and I find it pathetic behaviour. Toxicity does not belong here or anywhere else for that matter, and it solves nothing only creates new problems.

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Considering you need players for a game, toxic behaviour by default will have an impact on said players (that you need for the game). This is in addition to any issues with the game or its support, which you try to frame as “the” issue.

It could easily be both. It could be one of them (more than the other). But there’s no point trying to pretend toxicity doesn’t have an impact even if you think it’s not a major factor.

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Thank you! Someone at least understands it.

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I find it interesting that In-Game toxicity is pretty low relative to other titles. The forums can be pretty rough, but even the toxic Reddit jockies tend to keep it out of the game itself, which seems odd to me.

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I think I have made my points pretty clear.
Toxicity exists anywhere. It has a natural proportion (varies across situations but not so different). There are cases where the nature of the game itself fosters more toxicity but if I say AOE4 is such a game I believe you will be enraged.
If a game is solid, and/or the community has enough confidence and positivity, such toxicity is easily overwhelmed. I probably see more toxicity in league of legend than all other games combined but that does not affect the success of the game at all.
Back in the release this forum has a few thousand posts a day. You can hardly see toxicity at all. It’s not like a few months later suddenly a group of villains, who hate our fragile game so much that they post 100 posts 24/7 on the community just to undermine it, takes over the entire community, and the good people can do nothing about it besides pleading them to leave.

You can pretend the problem will be solved by simply purging all the toxic posts and posters. You can work 24/7 to kick every single one of them out of the forum and toxicity still grows. Like you can spray disinfectant two times a day on the dish you left unattended in the sink for two weeks, and believe that will improve the hygiene conditions.

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The things that get “improved” over time are mostly what should have been there at launch. I believe you think the same way (but G##bM##t will be enraged). Someone would write another thesis paper on why they are not universally absolutely mathematically 100% essential for every single person ever existed but that is undeniably a popular conception.
If the near future of the game is just “almost approaching an acceptable baseline” you cannot expect real positivity. Not to mention this process already takes quite long. You cannot win confidence or positivity back simply by pleading people not to beat a dead horse after things like, say DOW3 (just an example I suddenly came up with. Not specifically targeting at some certain dev team or company).

Just like you cannot expect the next patch to solve all the problems and bring all the 70k players at release back. For positivity to grow substantially, the game probably needs another year of solid updates with real new contents. Be patient.

EDIT: actually DOW3 is a good example. Before the launch there were numerous posts on “AOE4 is doomed because R###c made DOW3” and you rarely see that later (guess why?). Now that “toxicity” is back, not in the exact same form, but it is back, and even takes over (guess why?).

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Wanted to provide a proper response in traditional fashion, yes the game at its core can be very good, maybe even great (which i’d ofc want to see), but there will always be that day 1 effect happening, when you name the game age of empires, you set an expectation for quality basically, which day 1 did meet on the surface, but when the hype came back to earth, many cracks showed, no age game was perfect day 1, not even aoe2, but this was beyond the og games, by a lot. Did the patches improve quite a bit of it, yes, but then question becomes the following: was it enough changes in the time they had since launch, imo, not quite, the 6 week vacation (everyone deserves a good rest, not saying devs don’t deserve it, they sweat too) right after launch was a mistake, would be better to simply delay by that amount and ensure there’s some sort of team available for the game breaking exploits, this wasn’t helped by in my experience well below average pace of patching (especially initially it took forever to do simple number changes, basing this on what i’ve seen in the editor), on the bright side, feedback so far, with until recently famously ignored inadaquate zoom level, being taken into account, with game improving steadly, but there’s still a ton of work. As for role of community in this fallout, i agree it plays a big role, but based on many posts i read from many members of it, all criticism had a basis in the game’s state and how legacy RTS players in particular had it rough so far, unless they accepted the mandatory grid and other not ideal compromises, personally i had plenty of problems due to how specific my binds were in og games, how the zoom in this game caused plenty of headache, combined with no go to or select all hotkeys at launch. I still think however that new game experience for someone with no RTS experience still did a great job to introduce the whole concept of what the RTS is. If i had to rate the game with season 2 in mind and knowing roughly what season 3 will contain, i give it a 7/10, very good, but not quite great RTS, with multiple still unsolved legacy issues (tactical pause anyone?), despite not being super active in 4 rn, i still take every feedback survey to hopefully get this game where it should’ve always been, setting some standards, instead of failing to meet them. I played aoe 2 and 3 for 16 years at this point, and although they’re still my preference to play, there’s no reason for aoe4 to not get a spot with them, but only if things improve to truly provide something unique, that stands on its own 2 feet firmly

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We have all stated serveral times that this game was released way too early & things that are now being introduced with the upcoming patch but also the previous patches during these few months should all had been at launch.

We get it, it’s time to move on and look for the future of this game. Stop beating an old horse as it doesn’t help at all to bring up something, neither they or us can do anything about. The only thing that the developers can do is to continue updating the game and making it better with each patch.

You as a player have a choice to either play the game and look forward for the future, or take a break and come back later if you find this so frustrating that you cannot even play the game now. Nothing wrong with either of those choices.

All I’m saying is we all KNOW how the game failed in those regards at launch, but they are HERE now (most of them) especially with Seaon 2 patch around the corner. Can we stop bringing up same old whine that leads to nothing but negativity on these forums? Be glad they have addressed those issues, and still working on new things.

Now, what I want to see from the team behind AoEIV is to provide much better communication with us the player base to help us understand them better how they see things with the game, while also at the same time give attention to us the players, with things like Q&A’s were we get to ask them questions and just have an interaction with the team. This would go a long way in my opinion.

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Well the toxic people are a very small minority. People just enjoying the game are much less likely to post on forums.

And to be clear brining up issues with the game is not toxic, but there are definitely a few people who seem incapable of doing so without being complete assholes the entire time. Those are usually the same like half dozen to a dozen people though.

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yes they are getting better but it just a fraction of it of what we should enjoy but it’s not in a solid state because the issues like water combat rework or any other on the big list of flaws.

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There will always be things for them to address and fix, but the important game breaking issues & bugs from launch have all been addressed that I know of at least.

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