Because the idea is that you have to do as most as you can with the CA, so people prefer to use mangudai or camel archer to have a CA that can fill different roles.
Why I would go Mangudais if I can have CA cheap, easy to mass, more HP, more range and attack than Mangudais?
It shows one thingā¦ Mangudai fandom is toxic (?)
because mangudai have more attack, health, lower frame delay, and bonus damage against siege?
besides - taking Magyar hussars basically requires you to take the tech to make them gold free.
not guaranteed to take the mangudai, but to say it isnāt a step up from cav archers is a lie.
besides. have you ever given mangudai to huns? they benefit from the cheaper cav archer bonus.
Well, CA have the same range and HP of the mangudai, and less attackā¦ so your data are incorrectā¦
And what do you do with your HCA when the enemy is training rams and onagers? You need to use melee cav if you donāt have mangudai, so you arenāt using anymore CA, so your OP CA civ ālose pointsā for not using the CA for everything.
not to mention every bonus that applys to cav archers applys to mangudai.
True, and kipchaks and camel archers too.
Now that I think of it, nobody used kipchaksā¦
Well, Iām asuming Recurved bow and Others CA bonus and techs apply only for CA Line, not UU. Except for that to belong to mongolsā¦
This is Why I prefer Hussar Magyar for combo with my CAsā¦
In theory, recurve bow and other UT could affect mangudai, kipchaks and camel archers because they are classified as CA.
Just look at cumans mercenaries kipchaks, they are affected by everything.
But then you arenāt using a CA unit. I too have given bonuses for my melee cav, but only as collateral bonus, because they both affected my CA and stable units.
Now I will to test this in the editor to be sure 11
Idk, Arambai is classified as CA but blacksmith attack upgrades donāt affect itā¦
Arambai are a bit weird, they are affected by the armor though, like conquistadors, so they are probably a special archer unit type, like most gunpowder unit are considered, only that for arambai they are the only ones of their liking.
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I think they can be made viable in this theme, but easy to forget about them as currently they are not that good. I think their low base attack kind of makes it hard to buff them as much as you can buff Mangudai
Yeah but with such bonuses:
They could become really strong, probably is because they donāt really fill a spot, in the end they are a CA that shot 3 arrows more.
Though, if recurve bow affects all 4 arrows it may becomes a strong unitā¦ but I still prefer my camel archer.
Silk armor affects Genitour too. For other CA bonuses, Huns discount applies as well. So Iām assuming these 2 should affect Mangudai too. Recurve Bow is the only exception. So regular CA will have +1 range over Mangudai but Mangudai will still be stronger than CA.
My OP CA civ will be like this
Tech Tree - Magyars
Team Bonus - Archery Range works 20% faster (Britons)
Civ Bonuses -
- Cavalry 5%/10%/15% faster (Cumans)
- Wheelbarrow and Handcart free (Vikings)
- CA 10/20% cheaper in castle/imp (Huns)
- CA fires 25% faster
- Cavalry +20% HP
UT - Silk Armor and Recurve Bow
UU - Mangudai
OP Elephant civ
Tech Tree - Khmer
Team Bonus - Stables 20% faster
Civ Bonuses
Battle Elephants 30% cheaper
Wheelbarrow/Handcart free
Barracks and Stable units receive +1/+2 melee armor in the Castle/Imperial Age
All stable units cost 20% cheaper
Mounted Units have +20% hp
UT - Castle - Chivalry
Imperial - Farimba
UU- Karambit Warrior(This would just be an easy unit to spam and snipe enemy monks and/or fight off enemy halbs)
The Elephantās final stats would appear as this
hp - 380
att - 23
melee armor - 6
pierce armor - 7
cost - food - 60
gold - 21
training time - 9.6
So, you would have easily spammable, cheap, beefy Elephants. AWWW
You definitely want malay, just because heresy + faith.
You also want teutons team bonus for the same reason.
And of course berbers discount also affects eles.
Lastly you also want sicilians bonus for halbs only dealing half the damage.
extra hp / melee armor isnāt as important if you can spam them like crazy.
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They are classified as Conquisidors.
So Bloodlines, Husbandry, Archer Armor techs at Blacksmith. Unlike Conqs, they benefit from ballistics. Nothing else, apart from these affects them generally.
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selecting malay means removing 2 armor techs
So only burmese or khmer
Not important, they are so insanely beefy and cheap at the same time, no archer fire can stop their push.
Still takes 50 arbalest arrows to kill a 60 F / 21 G unit. Itās almost as durable as huskarl for a comparable price.
Their only weaknesses are counters and Monks.
Camels do not counter elephants even normally. Giving them Sicilian bonus makes Camels useless.