The most useless unique techs in AOE2 DE

Because there is no need.
Remember when I had stated that? Global techs are for global issues.
Unlike elephants and Hand Cannoneers, Castles and towers are decent enough, having no global issues.

But actually, Mahayana is very often researched as long as Bengalis can survive till that time.

Compared with the Goths, it seems that there is not much difference, but compared with other civilizations, the population difference is 14 when there are 140 Villagers, which is quite large. On the other hand, the Goths themselves are a civilization full of issues, and people have proposed reforming that population bonus.

I had also suggested that having Mahayana can also benefit other non-combatants like Fishing Ships, Trade Cogs, Trade Carts, and Monks.

Yes that is true I cant recall anyone using Kataparuto…the last 20 years…

Generally agree but the example you bring up is something (most) likely to happen in late castle to early imp in which case i dont think its ever worth it to prioritize nomads over mangudai production (or trebs).

Well, I would get it after I’ve maxed out for the first time. The issue is that, once you have sufficient buildings for 200 population space, you don’t even immediately see how much over the limit you are, how much buffer there’s left. You only get reminded once you fall under the limit, and when this happens, it’s already too late, and in this sitation other things may require more attention than adding houses anyway… :wink:

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Once i counted: Only the half of civs have usefull teambonus+ usefull castle age unique tech + usefull imperial age unique tech.

Honestly half is more than i thought.

Are you sure? I agree with Castles. But towers is not seen in Imperial unless you have already researched Yasama or Euopseng. And even then Koreans player have the option of BBT. I won’t mind a new University Tech for faster firing tower for a couple of civs. Maybe it can be a second tech after researching Arrow slit or the opposite. Can be worthy to pick up if your civ is really vulnerable to late game Hussar raid.

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When it becomes a tech that can be researched by multiple civs, it is not an unique tech.

Why does Tower have to be seen in the Imperial Age?

To be honest, keeping Tower balanced in the game is hard work, but currently it doesn’t have much of a problem. Maybe Tower still has room to get better in the late game, but unlike Elephants and the Hand Cannoneer, it’s in a decent state, often used in the early game and there’s no reason why it must be improved, just like many units in the game.

More importantly, changing the standard tech tree is a big issue that tends to bring more balancing work. The last time we saw this kind of change was the introduction of Supplies for Swordsmen, but currently Towers are used still more usual than Swordsmen. For now, other than Swordsmen, Elephants, and Hand Cannoneers, I don’t think there are any serious global issues else that only have to be solved by introducing new tech into the standard tech tree. For example, maybe just making Arrowslits offer more attack could already satisfy your need here.


Now that Yasama and Arrowslits are mentioned, I hope Yasama can change its name.

In Japanese, Yasama is “矢狭間”, and Arrowslits is translated as “狭間”. Even people who don’t understand Japanese at all can perceive how close the two are by observing the shape of characters. Because the two actually refer to the same thing, the Japanese translation can only deliberately make the difference of the word “矢 (Ya, arrow)” in order to distinguish between the two.

For the effect of the current Yasama, the name “Yagura” can also be accurately reflected.
Yagura (櫓, or 矢倉) is a kind of important defensive structure of Japanese castle similar to a turret or keep, common on the corners of the walls as a part of the walls. The term also literally means the storehouse for arrows.

I think Uni Tech was for “University Tech”, not “Unique Tech”…

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I have no idea why I stopped at “Uni” when I tried to type “University”.

Umm… why not? Why 1 castle should be worth more than 5 Keeps (not Watch Tower obviously) in Imperial for all but 2 civs?

Not saying it must. Just saying it may. Also only in Imperial and maybe even late Imperial. Furthermore, only for a handful civs. I can always hope it is likely to come in 2030 or at best 2025.

It used to be. But reduced to half extra attack in a later patch.

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Yep. Not every civ needs strong lategame towers, but having FU Keeps should actually mean that the building is at least situationally viable, as with other unit/building lines that get all upgrades. As it is, the (lack of) value of generic keeps isn’t at all congruent with other lategame upgrades, and like Dravidian battle eles, begs the question of why they’re even there.

It’s a common abbreviation in English and German, so nothing wrong with it. Whereas nobody abbreviates “unique” except as a single letter in UU/UT.

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I think that wouldnt be necesary as even after the UT Chinese castles will be worse than Byz ones

Not everyone in this forum is fluent in English and German.

Obviously I’m not suggesting to make Chinese Castles better than Byzantine ones.

I was just thinking that the more objects that benefit, the more people might be willing to access.

I just think that an effect reduction is unnecesaary when even with +30% hp Chinese will be worse than Byz

But 30% would be more than Hoardings, which is why I picked 20% if Great wall would benefit Castles.


By the way, I believe a UT that only serves on water maps is not a good UT. Most of the time in this game is fighting on land. Even when playing on water maps, civs with these UTs are not often picked, not to mention that even if those civs are used on water maps, they may not necessarily have the opportunity to research them.

In addition to its current effect, Greek Fire can also allow the player and the allies to build Fire Towers as a gimmick. Of course the Fire Tower may need some stats adjusted.

Carrack could be renamed so that it would reasonably also provide the armor to other units like the UU (e.g. “Navigation School”, especially when Organ Gun gets replaced by other more accuracy unit like Navigator), or so that it would also improve Feitoria such like allowing it to train UU or Villager, to fire arrow for defense, to be accessible since the Castle Age and/or maybe even to take less cost or pop (e.g. “Spice Trade”).

The Docks could be upgraded to Harbors free and automatically once having at least 1 existing Castle after hitting the Castle Age. The Malay Castle Age UT could be replaced by a brand new one.

It’s also bad for Silk Road to only serve team games. I’ve never even seen anyone researching it with a serious desire for its effects. In a previous thread, I had suggested renaming Silk Road to “Merchant Republics”, spawning a Merchant respectively for the player and each ally in addition to the original effect. The Merchant could generate gold as long as they stay alive so it would need to be protect carefully especially in 1v1.

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Sorry, but thats kind of dumb. Chinese dont have hoardings already so giving them an slightly worse version of hoardings for some reason while also nerfing their towers which are the only thing that is slightly better than what Byzantines have is a bad idea.

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That’s why I’m concerned. The Chinese do not have Hoardings, which may be from balance-related considerations, so if we want GW to benefit Castle, it may not be able to be higher than 21%. I cannot prove that the so-called considerations are true. So even if you think it can be 30% or higher when benefiting Castles too, I wouldn’t object. Just explained my opinion.

I don’t think so. Some water UT is necessary to maintain balance. For example

This looks too powerful.

Or it can be replaced with a new land UT. Portuguese ship HP bonus can be staggered to 10%/15%/20% HP in Feudal/Castle/Imperial.

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May I ask when was the last time you saw Harbor used in a serious way in a high level match? At least I haven’t seen it yet since DE was released.

It looks free, but actually still costs 650 stone, so it just makes the cost of the original tech itself (300 food, 300 gold) free, and the stats of Harbor could also be adjusted, or make it work after hitting the Imperial Age instead. What this change really means is that Harbor occupying a UT slot is effectively wasted. I don’t mind trying an idea that may look OP if there is a chance that let Malays be used as a competent water civilization that it was assumed to be.

I don’t mind the brand new Castle Age land UT, but +20% HP for all units over water is something to think about. Is +1/+1 armor at a price really equivalent to another +10% HP at no price?

I’m not sure if that’s the right analogy, but maybe it’s like if a civ had a bonus to give +20% HP to all land units. Every part of the rock-paper-scissors system gets a considerable boost.

I don’t either. But turning a generic building to Unique should be locked behind an UT. Or just add the new building available in Castle Age and villagers need to build it.

Maybe 15%. As Portuguese is already top 3-5 in water, maybe we don’t need to compensate the nerf totally.