veteran + Golden Pavilion + card + Isolation
veteran + Golden Pavilion + card + Isolation + shogun
Who do you think can beat them?
Next to them are these.
Falconet or mass CIR skirmisher, thankfully flaming arrow does not have multiplier vs artilery, and the only reliable way for japan to kill falc is by using nagi or yabusame
But if you kill all enemies before that, there is nothing more Falconet can do.
Don’t forget, Japan never uses only Yumi. They also use Ashigaru and Flaming Arrow.
flaming arrows out range the falconets
longbows are straight up better, so longbows will beat them.
so will any melee cav or art.
LB is definitely stronger than Yumi.
However, there is no opinion that Britain is more OP than Japan.
And how do other civs without LB deal with Yumi?
A simple comparison of units is meaningless unless you are using only one unit.
I wrote not only Yumi, I also wrote about Ashigaru and the shrine.
Besides that, I plan to experiment with other Japanese OP units and write a thread.
With 1475 ELO I seem to be dealing with japan just fine. Its almost a joke of how much you hate japan. Japan is fragile if you can exploit their evident weaknesses. Yumi are not OP. They are strong, but can be countered. What I consider OP is when you can amass one army of a select unit and still win, regardless of counters. Or OP in competitive play when cost efficiency is swaying games (based on stats, and resource cost). Number tweaking can help when a unit has shining leads in stats. Ultimately if you are not in the competitive scene it mainly comes down to MU’s and overall skill. If you play a game wrong then you are no doubt going to lose.
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Those who can target Japan’s weaknesses will surely be better player. I also don’t think Yumi’s base stats an OP. However, they have too strong power when combined with Ashigaru.
The combination of Ashigaru, Yumi, and Flaming Arrows is a combination that appears a lot and give it boring. If developers don’t want to nerf Ashigaru, they should nerf Yumi.
As an aside, they are more powerful than normally skirmishers. And they withstand cavalry better than they do.
Not really. Japan in my eyes is where they need to be (I dont play japan mind you). If it weren’t for ashi they wouldn’t be able to deal with cav. Samurai are trash for what they cost vs their return in play. Sure they have a niche for sieging. But how often is it worth going out of your way for the extra multiplier for building damage. Any one who plays versus japan knows they will 99% of the time go double racks with ashi as a prominent unit. Its almost a disadvantage for them. You as the opponent should already see it coming which allows you to react accordingly. Japan’s biggest asset are their shrines. Every time you burn one it throws them back five feet from where they started. Even better, you know exactly where they are without having LOS. Japan is pretty symmetrical in every game in the fact they need to reach mid to late colonial play. Just like British, its not in their interest to ff or rush. Again, if it weren’t for ashi Japan would be low tier in casual and maybe even competitive. They serve as a crutch for the missing ranged anti heavy cav (yabusame don’t count). Their numbers are fine. Japan is as balanced as that civ can be. One digit on anything can make them insane or an absolute steve buscemi.