The Republic of Venice: Definitive and Improved Version

A more in-depth analysis of the venetians landmarks:

So as already said, venetian landmarks are in general a bit weaker, and are meant to work combined with the nobles, but they are still useful in their role.
The venetians also can age up saving a bit of resources, which gives them a little bit of flexibility too, or like in the case of the age 2 landmarks, you can click up a little bit later on.

Feudal Age Landmarks:

Dogal Palace:

The dogal palace of which I’m talking about isn’t the one that you can visit nowadays, but an earlier version of it, of when the capital of venetian dux was moved on the island of “riva alta”. This building act as an early for of fortification from the were the doge can protect its citizens thanks to the natural defense of the lagoon.

The landmark can act as either a barrack or a dock. It doesn’t work faster than a normal building, ### #### ########### #### from the ability to adapt to the map.
The landmarks project a large area of effect where all enemy units (both on land and water) inside constantly receives a 40% speed debuff, to represent the difficulty of fighting an aggressive war in a lagoon. This greatly help you defend your base from early raids, especially against cavalry which loses it’s main advantage (especially if pair up with your stronger spearmen). Ram push too are harder, as the enemy needs to be sure to go for the kill, or he wouldn’t be able to retreat.
NOTE: the speed debuff doesn’t apply to the area around the enemy starting TC, so to avoid laming.

Palazzo-Ducale-con-Ziani

Customhouse Point:

Also called “punta della dogana”, this more than the actual landmark, it’s meat to represent a generic customhouse, as Venice in the early days had several of it.
Venice was a trade power, it was able to impose a monopoly, either by diplomacy or force, of the grain and salt in the whole Adriatic, as all the goods had to exchanged in city of Venice.

The landmarks aim to recreate such power, as it penalize civilizations that want to boom either trough the exchange of resources, or through trade. For the first, the free to buy and sell is increased by a third, so even landmarks like the golden gate are less strong. For the second effect instead it directly tribute you gold when an enemy trader interact with a neutral trade post, it doesn’t penalize him directly, but it make him generate free gold for you, as you gain early 15% of what he would receive.
On top of that, the landmark act as an ordinary market, but it can be placed on the shore to train merchant ships.

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As you can see, both landmarks aren’t particularly strong, but they are suited to counter specific strategy of the opponent. For that reason, the venetian player should carefully scout what the opponent goes for, and then age up a little bit later, in order to choose the correct landmark.

Castle Age Landmarks:

State Mint:

The mint of Venice was more than a simple mint, it was a marketplace for the venetians. Merchants could sell and buy good without having to bring coins with them, they could make transactions and send the material directly to the artisans that make the work, like for the famous glass of Murano.

In the game, the mint act as an emporium for this reason. I won’t go into detail of how the emporium works and how the mint affects it in this post, this is reserved for a later post. For now, it’s enaugh to say that combined with other emporium, the mint allows to invest gold into it, and receive a greater amount of it’s value over time, converted into any other resource, or just in gold

Veduta-della-Zecca-Incisione-del-1831-del-Moretti

University of Padua:

This is the only landmarks that it doesn’t belong to Venice. The university of Padua had a close relationship with Venice even before the city was under venetian control, as it formed most of its ruling class. Being one of the most ancient universities in the world, and the secomost ancient university in Italy, the university of Padua was one of the first and most prestigious ones, and allows figures like Galileo could teach more freely than in other european cities.

In game, the university of course act as an university, but it’s available an age earlier and have a small discount on the technologies, so to be able to research thdm earlier. Most techs are anyway expensive, so you won’t be able to get them fast, but still it can be a nice advantage.
NOTE: the unique technologies of the venetians aren’t available in age 3, but are restricted to the age 4 even with this landmark.

The castle age landmarks, as you can see, are both designed for the late castle age, as it gives small advantages right after being built. But as the castle age goes on, they become quite powerful, and they can help you close the game without needing to reach imperial age.

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Imperial Age Landmarks:

Arsenal:

The venetian arsenal was a pioneer of its time. It was the first industrial facility controlled by the state for the mass production of ships, and it was capable of building a ship per day. It’s workers lived inside it, and they were also responsible for its defense against coups, espionage and sabotage, making it basically the cornerstone of Venice defense.

With its ever increasing importance, the arsenal also become responsible for the manufacturing of weapons, housing blacksmith for making armors and weapons, and later on even for the manufacturing of gunpowder weapons too.

In the game, the arsenal it’s represented as a keep, that boost the working speed of nearby dock and military buildings.

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Fondaco:

The fondaco was a building quite common in the medioeval Europe, especially on cities that based their economy on trade, but few became as famous as the ones of Venice.

The buildings were hubs of trade, where merchants from other countries could reside and trade, it allowed for the exchange of goods, and they offered had stands to change currencies. The most famous ones in Venice were the fondaco of the turks and the fondaco of the germans.

In the game, the building its quite simple, being a market that allows to get into trade quite fast if you neglected it before, as it can train both traders and merchant ships (if placed on water) at 400% the speed, and with a reduced wood cost. If you already have a good and established trade, the building can still be good to boost your traders numbers, or to replace eventual losses, as with the insurances tech, you get the gold cost refunded (and any gold the trader was carrying) and with the fondaco you pay for just the 33% of the wood cost, basically reducing a lot the impact of any trader lost.

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On the contrary of the the castle age landmarks, the venetians imperial landmarks give them powers spikes in early imperial, either by massing military units, or by massing traders, but have little effect on post-imp. This is to represent the booming of the city of Venice, that was one of the most populated of the Middle Ages, but thzt declined at the end of the renaissance, with the discovery of the new world.

What do you think of the venetians landmarks, let me know your opinions below.

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Wonderful post, hope the developers take into consideration

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Thank you, it means a lot.

I’m too hoping to see Venice as a DLC civ alongside maybe the eastern roman empire or maybe spain.

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I agree, we need something original like the Venetians, since for now they have never been added in any age, I think they are the most original choice, currently even if some landmarks would be in the water, they could easily be built on land, here an example of a landmark that modify the terrain, Also to be in context, I don’t think it’s a problem to put some landmarks that are close to water on earth, it would be enough to put water around, and they would be contextualized with the game, for example an unrealistic thing created for game mechanics are Musofadi Gunners, for malians, which are actually 1800s units

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If you want, you could add in another unique technology called Mercenary Squads and what it can do is that it lets teammates create 5 Condottieri from a military building.

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My idea was that each landmark could be built either on land or onto the shore, depending on which you opted for, you get different advantages of course, so it encourages and rewards good decision making.

Like, the Dogal Palace can be either a barrack or a military dock, depending on where you build it, so you can age up either by securing water or by defending/rushing on land.

Yes of course, as other civ buildings generates roads and fields around it, the venetians buildings should generates canals and bridges.

Well, for Venice luckily there is plenty of content between the middle ages and the renaissance.

It could be an idea, some way to have the allies train condottieri and elmetti, and maybe their own captain of fortune.

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I’ll post here some changes to the venetian landmarks, as I wasn’t really satisfied with some of them:

General change and new civ bonus:

Landmarks and the Capital TC generate a bit of shallow water around them (aesthetically 1 tile) which applies a -25% speed debuff on nearby enemy units and prevent the enemy from building nearby (+2 tiles for each age).

This was the bonus of the Dogal Palace, but I fell like it should have been something not locked behind just one landmark, but something that depicted the whole civilization. For this reason, I nerfed the effect and the area, and extended it to all landmarks and your starting TC, so you can think of it a bit like the gaia lush of AoM. The effect is still similar, as the enemy can’t build nearby and its units get slower, this is to help the venetians defend from early aggression, and to represent the natural defense that the lagoon provided.

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Fish market landmark:

A dock that can be built with on the shore or on land (it generate a tile of shallow water around it). It generates 2 shore fish when built and keep generate additional shore fish every 150 seconds that can be gathered either by villagers or ships.

This landmark was scrapped from the first draft of the civ, as it had another effect, and the customhouse was more suited. I substitute it again as I wasn’t happy with the bonus that the previous landmark provided.
Now the landmarks provides a good economic buff, as even on land maps it allows you to get at least a couple of fishing boats to gather the food, and on water maps is one more dock. It also allows you to get a defensive building, as you can get arrowslits or some galleys like in any other docks.

Dogal Palace:

A special barrack that works 150% faster. You can use it to pay 100 gold in order to get a global cease fire for 60 seconds (5 minutes of cool down and the cost double after every use).
It also improves the line of sight into stealth forests of standard units and buildings.

I changed the effect of this landmark because I was afraid of its potential laming abuse, as you could build the landmark forward and slow back all the units in the enemy base while you massed halbs and siege down the buildings.
The new effect is better in my opinion, as it can be used both for defensive purposes and for rushing, and it suits more the landmark history, as Venice was famous for its diplomacy and spy network, which had its central at the dogal palace.

Fondaco:

A market that can train both traders and merchant ships 200% faster and makes trade units take 20% less population. It can train both traders and merchant ships if placed on the shore.

This one hasn’t changed a lot. It’s still a market that can train both traders and merchant ships faster if you want to get into trading after focusing on something else during the other ages, but now it also have the effect of reducing the population of the trade units, so to allow you to either have more traders, vills or military units.

Condottieri and Elmetti:

The ability to block the enemy attack is now shared by both the condottiero (their unique man at arms) and the elmetto (their unique knight) but for this reason the chances of parry attract is reduced to 15% (it works on both melee and ranged attacks, but only if there is 0.5 tile or less between the two units).

The condottiero still maintain their faster attack rate, while others statistics of the elmetto are unchanged.

While I liked for the venetians to have a restricted roster in the early to mid game, that is expanded in imperial, I felt that locking the knight-line before imp just for them to have a standard knight then, it was too weak, for this reason I decided to buff them a little bit.
You can still get both units in castle age by choosing the captain of fortune, in that case the ability is nerfed to 10%, and automatically upgraded when reaching the imperial age.


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I will try to disseminate the Venetians in the community, I hope they are not forgotten, even with the addition of the Byzantines they would make sense

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Hey imagine if you can use the Rialto bridge, i’see in the history the Rialto bridge it was made of wood an can be open like the Tower bridge of Londra, soo can be soo cool if it can be use like for passing the rivers, also in the campaign of the game have some wood bridge, soo the enemy need to focus the bridge for don’t let you repare it and use, probably the game now dont have alot map for doing this sadly, i still remember the confluence map

Screenshot 2023-03-16 095005

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why do u ppl care so much about having 20 civs? when the majority of players have at most 3 main civs, and cant even play them well.

we need to draw the line here, at what point is many enough?

are we not playing this as a strategy game? mliitary, eco, map control… why the need for ‘new features’?

yo all of this post is just dreaming, i’played this game for like 2 year, when you get this too many hours, you know just how use all civ, in the game, and i’change it all the time, this is a historic game, just the peaple want to have something for feel more interpreted, this is just age of empire not star craft, more civ more strategy and more decision making in live, if you do just the same, the game get boring, bc you just doo the same strategy all the time whit tiny change, like a robot or star craft, maybe you don’t feel that, but i still love the game and i have more than 3000 h now, so i just want to dream, the new player maby don’t feel that, but if you are an old player you can feel, and also all age of empire game have more then 10 civ, where to remember the story if not in a game set in it? I don’t play only for the competitive but also for everything else, otherwise I would play star craft first, I have other friends who stopped playing for these reasons, because they didn’t enjoy it anymore due to the lack of new special mechanics, which I only see with the addition of new civilizations.

there were many more players in aoe2 20 years ago, and they played huns only, dry arabia only, how do u explain?

also, sc has 3 civs and many more players??? same map??? not even random

yes but this is not an excuse to motivate your question, times have changed and age of empire 2 is a different game, even the people who play it

I understand what I write may seem frustrating but they are opinions, everyone has their own

your opinion is fair, just as mine.

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star craft is not set in a historical period like this game, it automatically makes you imagine less new types of civilizations instead age of empire because it is history it inevitably makes you compare the civilizations in the game with those existing at that time

你好,这是我最近设计的威尼斯民族介绍,希望能对你的想法有参考。

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Oh wow, this seems very well designed but I unfortunately can’t read it…

Could you maybe translate it for me?

Permíteme:


威 尼 斯 人

Venetians

AD 697-1453

佣 兵 团 火 炮 其 当
Mercenary - regiment - artillery

The Venetians are rich and ambitious, and their well-developed trade and technology bring a lot of wealth, satisfying the need to hire troops and develop advanced weapons. Opponents must be careful to watch out for the artillery bombardment of Venice.

Renaissance

In the first era, art colleges can be built, craftsmen can be produced, and geometry can be researched and developed without congratulations.

Mercenary Corps

In the second era, a special architectural mercenary center can be built, and mercenaries from different regions can be selected to fight for themselves.

  • Legion of France: crossbowmen instead of crossbowmen, royal knights instead of knights. Cavalry training speed +20%. (Note: As arbaleister is traduced as crossbowmen, it refer to the french unique unit)

  • Middle East Legion: Generate camel archer, generate camel cavalry. Spearmen gain +1 attack range.

  • Ottoman Army Brigade: Bodyguards replace musketeers, resulting in marching bands. Siege weapon production speed -20%

  • British Guards: Longbowmen instead of infantry archers, Wingard infantry instead of warriors. Infantry armor +2.

  • Orient Traveler: Imperial Guards replace Samurai, produce Grenadiers. Troop Fire Damage +15.

  • Turkic Cavalry: Generate Turkic Cavalry, Generate Fire Spear Cavalry. Ranged infantry movement speed +30%

  • (Existing mercenaries will leave when the mercenary contract is replaced)

Gunner
Price of gunpowder and siege units - 15%. Large battleships cost -10%.

Noble trade
In the second era, you can build a special building, the Piedi Trading Company, and you can choose to slowly replace food, wood, and stone with gold.

Influence
All building techs near colleges cost -25%.

Unique units

-Craftsman: Good at construction and maintenance, stationed in the building can make the building slowly and automatically restore health.

-Bronze Sun Cannon: In*stead of a push cannon, it can fire imperial cannonballs with arcs.

-Fixed cannon: an expensive turret that can fire a super long-range
Distant shells.


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Thank you.

Not all of Venice prominent history was about the renaissance, but I agree that it’s the most famous part.

Anyway I like the idea of an early university, although it should also be cheaper, or with some way to make its techs more accessible.

The craftsmen sounds a lot like the aoe3 architects, but I fear that on aoe4 they can be heavily used for tower rush strategies.

Anyway I tinkered a bit with a similar unit too in my design.

This I don’t like very much instead if I have to be honest, for 2 reasons:

  • first, Venice really mostly used either Italians or balkans mercs mostly, sometimes some germans or french mercs, but not really english or arab mercs.

  • second, it remove the opportunity to instead give them actually their unique units.

This is nice, but english already have a 10% discount on all ships, so maybe it should be something like war ships are 20% cheaper.

Only the building techs, well that’s not a lot.

I like it, like the aoe3 lombards, although when compared to some other market landmarks it would probably need a buff.

I like it, in the end it was Galileo that jump start the research on ballistics, and the venetians were pioneers into gunpowder weapons.

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