imo, they seem very 1 dimensional up to late game when they can start pumping out their UU and buffed CA. So on paper they look like they will just get rekt by mid game vs the A and S tier factions if your opponent is equal skill.
If you dont scout rush they literally have nothing going for them, so if the opponent thinks slightly ahead and walls or archer rushes with just a couple spears it’s hard countered, leaving them with literally no advantage until castle age and beyond.
And for some incredibly weird reason, a light cav civ doesnt have squires? What are their infantry, non magyar slaves?
Maybe i just need to watch more videos of players using them…
They have MaA with free attack upgrades and vills immune to wolves, so MaA with Trush is actually good.
They also have more LoS on archers, so they raid better and work perfectly with their cheap scouts.
They are decent, and they are actually use quite often.
That’s a good point. OP is right to some extent, tho: magyars don’t have much going for then in mid game/castle age. In my view, Magyars must strike at feudal, use the advantage to keep up in castle, and strike again at late game.
I don’t get the reasoning, what does being a light cav civ has to do with your barrack techs?
The free attack upgrade (that are almost always researched late for other civs) does give them a sizeable boost for going knights.
Magyars are pretty versatile. FU arbalest + Magyar Huszar is another cheaper yet effective variation of CA+Huszar in late game. Yes they have no real eco bonuses but I bet they’d be OP if they had one
free attack upgrades + cheap scout line + cheap effective armies + an eco bonus?
My only complaint is that they lack both hand cannons and the last armor upgrade for infrantry, so they can struggle against goths. The only option is heavy scorps with some meatshield in front…
Magyars feel like they are supposed to be this the only civ that has fully upgradable archer line and knight line - the only civ that can do that. Being able to make a composition that normally requires 2 teammates to do. At the same time they don’t have eco bonuses, but do have military bonuses. Most of those military bonuses allow them to make good cav but there are few weird ones for archers - none of which truly give you any advantage in going archers ( Team Bonus: Foot archers +2 LOS).
You definitely shouldn’t make their cav any better directly nor indirectly (no cav bonuses, no eco bonuses).
But I would welcome a bonus that would make their archers somehow more justifiable.
I see potential of Magyars as this civ that makes archers and stable units at the same time - one civ to fight them all. No eco bonuses, but aggressive one, the one that specializes in both cavalry and archers (as well cav archers as a combination of those) but they have no eco bonuses to support it faster than the enemy going only one out of these options.
Therefore I feel like giving them cheaper archery ranges or free crossbow upgrade would be a fitting change. The civ that lacks eco bonuses so has to compensate by being aggressive.
I’m up for cheaper archery ranges
Magyar Huszars beat cost Huskarls cost effectively.
Well… Magyars have every feudal unit but skirms buffed.
True that they do not have a direct eco bonus, but their scout rush is one of the best in the game. M@a are very powerful, spears are buffed as well. Archers slightly above average. I wouldn’t say their feudal age is weak.
In castle age and early imp, the free attack is better than Lithuanians relic bonus.
They have a good boost for Knights, small boost for crossbowman, the best trash unit in the game, two very strong late game unit (paladins and CAs). They are extremely good both as pocket and flank.
Considering that there are civs like Turks, Italians, Portuguese or Koreans, they do not need a huge modification. Those civs are the priorities. Maybe something small for Magyars…
If you want to really buff them, give them +100 starting wood or similar.
The problem is not huskarl alone, the problem is halbs+champs+huskarl. How do you counter that effectively as magyars? The best I can think of is heavy scorps + champions, but it’s probably going to struggle against the goth flood.
Of course, on open map you will try to stop goths before getting to that point, but on closed maps that’s very often not feasible.
then as you said scorpions+Huszars
yeah they definitely dont have a problem late game (as i said) but up until that point it feels like the top tier races can do almost everything they can do, just better thanks to eco upgrades…
I think what magyars lack is something to improve their midgame. They a very solid scout rush, but after that they can struggle a bit. I think @AlightJewel1130 made a good proposition, cheaper archery ranges make it easier to go for archers and perhaps later on transition to cav archers.
I’m sorry, but how do they struggle mid game? They get +2 attack knights the moment they hit castle age
You have to get there first. If you go heavy into scouts in feudal, you are delaying your castle. This can be effective (if you manage to do a lot of damage), but it is a risky strategy. If you don’t invest heavily into scouts, than you need to transition into something else (assuming we are talking about an open map). And as magyars you don’t have any eco bonus or discount except the melee attack blacksmith upgrades, which are probably the least important one.
Moreover, knights are not always the best choice, it depends on the opponent. If there are monks around for example…
Except if you’re going scouts you’re delaying your enemy as well.
It depends. There’s no guarantee that the damage you will do is worth the resources you spent. Scouts are very taxing on feudal eco.
like others have pointed out, m@a with forging is pretty strong and can be a nice surprise with enemy expecting scouts. In castle age, you can follow it up with knights with +2 attack (very rarely you see other civs even research forging at this stage) or switch to archers in feudal to xbow.
I agree their scout rush isn’t the greatest since scouts is about speed before your opponent finishes walling.