What do you think about those full boom pockets?

Age of Empires II: DE II - Discussion
21

nope, there’s no way to stop it, sometimes you team with a teamplayer, sometimes it’s a selfish player.
The only thing for you to control is your attuitude, expect 1v2 if your pocket is not your friend.

Few days ago, I had a game with a guy, he gets to Fedual age but with no army, claiming he wants Fast castle. I checked few of the Arabia games he played, most of them are doing this approach and most of the games he’s losing as well.

Clearly, a lost game wont teach such players a lesson. lol

I think people have a misunderstanding about how free boom works.
In a half open map like Arabia or Hideout,
full boom only works when your opponents are not serious, are your current Elo is low or middle.
that also made an illusion to those noobs as well.

I played some local competitions within a discord group,
In a real serious match, heavy army always is a big advantage to destroy the flank.
Maybe my elo is not that good enough for this concept thing.
but so far the games I watched, most of the competition wont doing full boom at all.

22

You will be my team mate as soon as I will restart playing TGs 11

I know your point. It is very frustrating…

23

maybe we should make a score value system among players themselves.

We value each players after the game. (not for the duo team they can value to their teammate themslves)

This can also improve the afk or some rage quit guys.

24

In my opinion, this should be against the rules, but I’m well aware it isn’t.

As long as it isn’t against the rules, who am I to judge?

25

What? Why?

Under 1250 they can’t even do a straight archer build.

26

Because when you enter a team game there ought to be a social contract you’re all trying to have fun, and this obligation ought to be especially strong wrt your team mates.

In an extreme case, someone could play far beneath his actual strength, then systematically let his teammates die and proceed to attempt to win the resulting 3v1. I hope it’s clear why that would be bad. (I’m finding it hard to put into words atm.)

Letting a teammate die because he’s not good enough seems similar. (Though I think it’s not quite as bad as that extreme case.)

27

Yes, I’m trying to win, so I let my noob teammate die and boom into 28 minute Paladin or Battle Elephant. What’s the point of making Scouts vs Scouts/Archers or Knight vs Indian Camel/Crossbows?

28

I rest my case

29

It’s a crap shoot when you get random team mates. I try to play with friends if I can. But if in the mood for a team game and no one’s around what I’ve often done is hope i find a good team mate, and then ask him if he wants to que up for a few more games with me. Over time I get a friend list of guys who I can ask to play team games with me if I see they’re on when I am :man_shrugging:

30

I have years playing with chinese and vietnamese players, they don’t talk at all, they do whatever they want to do as pkt or flank, so i know what i am saying, you can’t expect great communication with all the players cause of certain limitations but that doesn’t mean you can’t communicate, just use the basic taunts and get carto.

Like i said it depends if the match is unfair, you guys don’t have the level to understand this but fc one stable boom=auto win vs pkt making sc in the long run the economic difference btw two similar skilled players is around 30 vills min 28, so if the flank can hold and not to die vs feudal army but most important not to quit, the game is defined by the strongest pocket in the game.

31

Lol really? You are assuming every person who reads this forum is so far below you that they can’t understand you? Haha ok, didn’t realize you were the Viper.

Your point isn’t wrong about an untouched boomer. But in the event that your flank doesn’t hold, or the opponent sees what you’re doing and both move from flank to you, then you get steamrolled since you have no army lol. It’s a situational game, there are situations where you can get away with greed and win, there are others where greed gets punished hard.

That said I’m not judging your playstyle, ultimately if you communicate with your team, and are trying to do what will help the team win, that’s what matters IMO.

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32

I see. It seems to me that you are thinking of a very competitive scenario. Sometimes people care more about having fun, and in that case letting your flank die is terrible. It makes sense to play a game as a flank if you see you are going to die (and everything depends on your teammate), only if you care just about winning.

If you want to have fun it may be better losing a 2v2 than looking at your pocket winning 2v1.

I am more for having fun, but it is another perspective…

33

One stable fc boom, doesn’t mean you are not making army, you are making kths like 5 min 18, once you have 4 tcs you start adding more and more stables, so you have more army and vills, that is the point of that strat, 5 kths should be enough to defend unless your flank is wide open and has a party on his town, then at that point you can’t save him, even if you went sc that doesn’t guarantee that your ally knows how to protect himself.

All good players knows that going sc as pkt is only worth if you can make damage to someone otherwise you will be behind on economy, so if i see my pocket booming i am not going to rage quit because i got doubled, i would just try to buy him more time, because i have experience in both sides, i would prefer 100 times a pocket booming than my pkt making 8 scouts and getting late to castle age while the other pkt has been 8 minutes in castle age making economy cause i know that difference will translate in more army or faster imperial time.

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34

You’re definately right for some situations. But how do you know that your opponent won’t see your booming, and move from your flank to you?

What I mean here is if they move into you right as you’re about to hit castle or just after. That’s a moment where you’re strapped for res, and suddenly you get hit by 6 scouts and 12 archers, that’s pretty tough to deal with even with a hypothetical tech advantage. In a pro level team game how often do you see naked FC?

I’m just saying it’s a situational game. As long as you’re communicating with your team and trying to do what’s best to win that’s great! But pocket fc kts every time isn’t always the right play.

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35

2x2 is different than 3x3 or x4, to play 2x2 you need to trust in ur partner more than in the other game modes, getting doubled in 2x2 is more lethal, the distance is shorter so you don’t have that extra time, basically you need either an amazing map to wall or army, there aren’t too many options there.

Is not competitive is about common sense, the players that don’t wall well are way more in any level than the guys trying to go boom, that makes the difference in scales, you will find more players dying because they couldn’t complete the wall in time than getting doubled by large numbers of feudal army.

36

what is your solo elo is?

38

It really depends on whether you play with randoms or premates and what map you are on.

I’m have a 4 player premate team. What we sometimes do on Hideout is to have an offensive and a defensive flank.
So for example the left side plays standart. For example the flank plays archers, the pocket scouts into knights.
On the right side the strongest player in the team chooses a defensive Civ (like Byzantines) and plays the flank position. He walls, builds early defensive castles, counter units and Mangonels… -> this gives the right pocket the opportunity to do something creative like booming hard (and at some point the defensive front suddenly becomes very offensive), OR go for an all in push on the left fank (to overwhelm the enemy early), OR sling the flank player on the offensive front (early elephants :smiley: ), OR go fast Imp and support the aggressive flank with trebs…

There is really a lot of fun things you can do as a team.
But if you are queing solo, that’s not possible. I would recommend to stick to 1v1s on that case…

39

To be honest, the most common thing at 2200-2400 ELO in team game is flanks doing no units.

Most of the time, when i play pocket, i see my flank getting rekt in pure 1 vs 1. The guy is literally incapable of defending himself from 3-4 scouts and loses 10 villagers for free. In the best case scenario, he still freezes all his eco for 5-10 minuts No unit, no tower, no fast wall, nothing.
It’s even worse when he is against an archer civ. It’s almost always gg.

I don’t even have the time to go Castle that my flank ragequites.
When he doesn’t, i send my knights, the enemy flank send his.
I have to face 3 vs 3 knights + scouts/archers, i lose, and i can see my flank say “GG 1 VS 2 ALL GAME LONG NO HELP” and leave.

Yesterday, again, i saw that. Arabia, My ally’s flank was far away from us. He didnt wall. Had 0 units. Ofc, the enemies rushed him, scout + archers. Yeah in this case, he was 1 vs 2. But that can happen and you have to handle his kind of things as flank.
The guy was totally lost. He did nothing, no fast wall, no tower, no units, nothing.
The best moment was when he ringed the bell. Literally 10 seconds after, we don’t know why, ~6 villagers went out from his TC, and he send them back in a resource spot camped by enemies archers.
This pocket send knights and start fighting.
The guy evac ALL his villagers in front of enemies units and start to move them out of his base to go to us.
Yeah, ofc, the enemies rush him.
“GG 1 vs 2 i can’t stand it anymore”.

Less common, from time to time, i see my flank rekting his opponent. The guy can handle his battles, his eco is safe, everything is going well, so i am going full boom and rush imp to build trebs and destroy defensive castles while having a great end game eco.
But my flank does not like it and flame me. “OMG GO AND HELP ME, I NEED HELP OMG **** **** ** ***”

But yeah, i can also see shi*ty pockets incapable of changing their BO whatever happens to their flanks. Khmers gong full boom imp and starting to create their first units when they have 125 villagers while their flank is getting destroyed 1 vs 2 is still a popular strat right now.

For me it’s obvious that team games are unbalanced and ravaged by ELO boosted guys.
I am at 2100 ELO in team game right now, and i still see this kind of things in almost every game i am playing…

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40

threads like this are why i always suggested that allied vision should be the default setting for general matchmaking. people don’t communicate.

the matchmaking can put people who don’t even speak the same language together against teams who are using voicechat, and that’s a huge imbalance

if they want to turn it off shared vision for tournaments and custom games, then let them do that. but not being able to see what allies are doing or when they’re aging up is archaic

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41

that’s their fault tho, communication is a very important factor in tgs