Since Khmer got the no mill bonus for farms, this begs the question why 2 other weak civs haven’t been given the other 2 options? It’s of course going to be a strong bonus just like Khmer farms. You can simply just lower the work rate if needed just like they did with Khmer. There isn’t really a good reason not to implement these 2 bonuses.
Mining maybe but lumber would be hilariously broken. Considering how often one you need to refresh your lumber camps
Imp is when you have to refresh a bunch of lumber camps and usually you have enough villagers that a few hundred wood at a time isn’t a big deal. The civ could have lumberjacks that are the slowest chopping in the game to offset the need to walk back and forth.
That is just such an unoriginal bonus + way too strong. Changes aoe2 core mechanics for a civ (even more than for khmers the farm bonus)
This. The Khmer bonus can be rationalized in the sense that the farm itself serves used as drop off, while dropping wood/gold/stone into thin air is just pushing it too far.
At least that’s my opinion.
It would make the dark age of any civs with a similar bonus ridiculously OP. Imagine start gathering wood anywhere you want without the need of building a lumber camp, or stone/gold without a mining camp.
You can simply go anywhere in the map and randomly start gathering resources, and then just move again, when this is depleted. Or if the enemy raid you, you simply hide you vills in a corner and start gathering resources without even the need of building a gathering point.
Kmer farms are balanced because at least, when you build a farm, you are forced to let your vill work there, or to build another farm elsewhere, so there is a cost anyway.
Maybe AOE3 is something for you
The civ with no lumbercamp would be the best civ on forrest nothing
Honestly, do some people even think before they publish those things?
This means you dont need any lumbercamps which is insanely broken.
It could be compensated with lowered workrate though. So that lumberjacks would have in the end the same efficiency, but player would be free from need to spend attention on building lumbercamps and would avoid loss of efficiency when he forgots to build new lumbercamps.
Topic author himself said, that:
Lowering their work rate that much would make them completely useless on any kind of nomad maps, everygame will be lost already in Dark Age.
This idea breaks too many maps
Its also awfully unoriginal and better than Khmer one (unless the nerfed workrate is downright terrible, lumber rate can be upgraded unlike farm rate and wood dropoff needs much more walking as the game goes on). Its like the eco upgrades cost no food suggestion, way better than the vietnamese one
You don’t even understand you are comparing something that is readily available at the map, to something you need to build first and which costs resources itself, do you?
You can nerf their work rate so that they have the same gather rate as other civs with a lumber camp 1 or 2 tiles away.
Overall their collection rate is the same.
You say this is unoriginal yet the game has a bunch of similar bonuses: free farm upgrades and free wood upgrades, melee infantry attack bonus (Burmese & Aztecs), spearman speed bonus (celts & Lithuanians), extra damage to buildings (Burmese & Indians) etc.
It’s not just the gathering rate, it’s the convenience of don’t have to build lumber camps (200w save only in dark age) or mining camp (100w again only in dark).
They could also just gather resources everywhere they want, then just move anywhere else in the map, without any limitation.
Yeah that would be the benefit of the bonus—saving wood.
Just like the benefit of Khmer is that you can build farms without having to worry about mills.
But once you build a farm, your vill is forced to remain there, otherwise you have to build another farm (or wait for the reseeding).
For trees and mines you could just move you vills too freely.
Also, kmer bonus really come into play way after than an hypothetical no drop off wood/gold bonus.
Why not just cheaper lumbercamps then?
The difference, as DoctBaghi said, is that to build a farm you invest 60 wood, and can only work on that farm in one place; whereas with trees they are all over the map and require no investment (other than a lumbercamp) to gather.
If a Khmer player lost his base, he would lose his farms and have to spend 60 wood for each to gather food, if no-lumbercamp-civ lost his base, he could go literally anywhere to get wood without spending any extra res.
Well you don’t have to worry about refreshing them which keeps your efficiency high. If you didn’t refresh lumber camps then it would be more efficient.
Why is that a bad thing? You put your villagers in danger if you just move them without any base for protection. At least Khmer get houses for protection. Also if your base gets wrecked then you are pretty much dead anyway.
You can hide them in a corner, and your enemy would become mad in trying to search them.
Also, again, it would be an OP start, it would be at least 300w saved only in dark age.
If you are hiding villagers in a corner, then you are definitely dead. All the opponent has to do is get spies to see where they are.
It would be 200w if we are talking about lumber camps.