I think they were probably not happy with the design of the civ.
The main complain of the top players wasn’t that swedes were op, but that they were too one dimensional.
They designed the civ to be used aggressively and as a civ they relies on mercenaries.
Instead people only made 2 single unit types on the whole game.
You would rarely see another unit apart from caroleans and canons all the time.
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To make civ use mercs they should add significant bonuses, not just restricting them from building regular light units and allow them to build mercs instead. Now swedes helpless vs goon+skirm combo that almost every civ uses in age III. Mercs too expensive to use and easy to counter, caroleans were nerfed, and that infinite skirms-goons cards are not helping at all.
You can’t just remove that 100w from the cost, swedes forced to build torps even if they don’t need that extra population, so all 125 wood is going for extra gathering rate in that case. You need at least 8-10 torps just too not to lose in terms of eco, not talking about booming.
Swedes eco penalties (-1 starting vil and not having age II vils card) for torps is too big for the current torps value. They should remove them all.
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I think Torp has only now found its place.
However, instead of losing something extraordinary, they had to regain their mediocrity.
They should have earned 6 Settler Starts and Settler Cards, but it didn’t happen at all.
Exactly. But he doesn’t seem to understand so I didn’t wanna drag the conversation. Thanks for bringing it up.
I think giving them a 5 vill shipment on age 2 and 6 vill start would be a good start.
I am against reverting blueberries nerf, but I think englesberg ironworks could be reverted to 125% or even buffed to 150% as it would help them to get mercs out faster.
hahahahah voce temtou fazer um boom de vacas com os torps ? funciona sabia eles colentan bem rapido
Sure Sweden is not forced to build torps, who will need useless extra population?
Why is Sweden still choosing to build them sure because they consider torps eco bonus worth 125w.
Moreover all of us know that Sweden had the most OP eco and this was rocket type booming which broke the game. Now Dev just make them become more normal. Who have said Sweden have to be top one eco?
Compared Sweden to China, Lakota, Haud, Az, etc, Sweden eco is still much better.
You are missing 6-7 vils (1-2 from the start and 4-6 from the shipment) in age II not talking about other civ eco bonus, so you forced to build 8-10 torps just to keep up with the enemy. Half of the possible torps are not even for booming.
Swedes have the weakest age III army without any light unit in it, so they should have strong eco to make it work or build expensive mercs.
And my suggestions are adding 1 starting vil and 4/5 vils card age II, how it makes their eco “top one”? It just adds options to not relate on torps. With 6 vils from the start swedes can go early aggression with good ageup time. With 4/5 vils card they can go vils-related eco instead of using torps from the start.
I didn’t disagree add 1 vil or 4/5 vils for Sweden.
My main concern point is only how is torp now, because most civs are only training vils one by one in tc and torp is additional eco house.
On the other hand, this is totally wrong because mecrs are more expensive so Sweden needs better eco.
According to your logic, Russia, China and az have the worst quality army in the game so their eco should be the worst because their army is cheaper?
So Sweden can have same quantity mecrs as Russia strelets, to you is this fair?
Yes, Sweden’s eco is absolutely wrecked now. Only masochists will play Sweden now. If the devs wanna correct their pointless over-nerfing to a more balanced level, they could start by only reverting the radius of torps and the blueberry functionality. Perhaps that could lift Sweden from it’s current unplayable state to a little more playable civ.
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I have added your suggestion to the original post
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I’ve never said that. Mercs army always costs more than a regular army with the same power not same quantity (ofc they cost more for the same quantity too).
Yeah their stats look good and maybe 1 jaeger can even kill 2 (200c (333 vil/sec) is almost equal to 100f+130c (335 vil/sec)) veteran skirms in scenario editor, but in real game players are using attack move, and it makes stats advantage for jaegers a bit less efficient, 40 skirms will target more enemies with attack move than 20 jaegers, and can easily win direct battle (just tried it in the scenario editor, 14 skirms survived).
i think the most irritating change is the collision/radius of torp builds. THAT IS SOOOOO TOTALLY UNNECESSARY and a pointless and useless change.
secondly blueberries should be reverted to its previous state
ironworks should have been left alone
carolean changes ok - see how that goes.
changing balance should be a gradual/moderate process. not change the entire characteristic and destroy well practised routines!!!
I AM SO FRIGGEN ANNOYED !!!
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@KingKoong888 Welcome to the forum. Yes, completely changing the way the civ is supposed to play in just one patch is not a good move. It even makes harder for us to suggest alternatives. You feel like you were hit by something and need a moment to regain your senses before even attempting to give your opinion.
These things need to be changed bit by bit.
hi!
i have been playing this game since the first release. i am an old guy who has been around a while playing this game for well over a decade!!!. i have NEVER been so annoyed at a patch before that i have actually bothered to sign up to a forum and moan about it. hahahaha
it really has stunned me how annoying it is to play now esp with placing the torps. the other changes has just totally disrupted the game flow that i have gotten used to and now have to figure out ways to deal with a destroyed civ
in fact. i have played one crappy game online and got wiped out due to being slow at figuring out things were so different now and i couldnt adapt quick enough … i just got so pissed that i couldnt be bothered playing any more.
So you want no nerfs and only buffs to Caroleans. Got it. Thank god you are not a balance designer in this game.
Sweden should have been changed much sooner, or reworked to their current state before release of DE. As you can see, some Sweden players are delusional and think that last patch Sweden was in a fine state.
Its not a pointless change, read the justification again. The devs do not want you to put 6 Torps around one goldmine. I’m sure its going to get adjusted a little so they are a little easier to place. Then torps will be in a perfect spot.
All of you who pretend that Sweden is suddenly a terrible civ (which is isn’t, look at China which is bottom tier since release of DE, go nerfed again with this patch and needs some earlygame buffs desperately) watch Aussie_Drongo figure out how to play Sweden or read the ESOC forums. The best Sweden players are constantly figuring out new builds and refining their current build.
Sweden Age 2 received massive buffs for their economy try to play with 3 vills, 4 torp wagons, 700w, 600w, blueberries or somethign similar and you will see. Caroleans are good in Age 2 now which was an issue before. Leather cannons are good, its worth building them in Age 2 and you can spam Caros + Leather cannons from multiple Rax in late age 2. Ontop of that you still have the option to fast Age, unlike booming civ like Brits.
Between this month we can see:
Before Sweden nerf, most players except Sweden players felt Sweden is OP.
After Sweden nerf, most Sweden players are feeling Sweden is UP and disagree the adjustments.
Just it.
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I have no idea why Aussie is trying to work with a broken Sweden. I would just wait for the next patch. There’s no way Sweden will be left at this awkward state, so no point in coming up with new strategies at the moment. It’s not even about being nerfed. Every single nerf Sweden got up until this point was alright. Except the blueberry one. Managing sweden economy is so annoying in the early stage now.
This was the perfect time for him to stream other civs. Forget Sweden for a while. I know I did. I dropped Sweden as soon as I read the patch notes for torps.
Currently playing Portugal and Haude.
Blueberries needed a nerf though, you pretty much just needed your vills to gather wood the whole game and the civ would be still well alive in the game even if they lost 3/4 of their vills.
Aussie drongo worked around the nerf and found a way to make the civ competitive again and making blueberries a relevant car
Ironworks didn’t needed a nerf though imo and the civ could benefit from vill shipments on age 2. Apart from that the civ is fine
They could have nerfed blueberries with a better design. Maybe decrease the gather rate. IDK. I have discussed this too much already. Now it’s up to the devs.
Just want this awful design removed. They used the same design as the fish crate. I hate it.