My Honest opinion after almost two years

[jimmy19846071]

Hi all, this will be a long thread on disappointments and some hopes for the actual version and about Aoe4 future.

Shortly, i had very high expectactions about the new installment in the AOE serie: are were not waiting for 15 long years since the AOE3 launch?

What were the reasons behind my expecations? I suppose the same of the most of you:

1. the first announcment at gamescom 2017 and the renovate XBOX efforts on this legendary franchise: 2017 was the 20th anniversary of the Aoe. During the Gamescom was streamed the live show fo the future of AOE. How many incredible moments there: AAOE2 and AOE3 definitive editions were announced https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iI_bFPIYfbY

2. the first announcment of the AOE4: the live reactions were amazing

Age of Empires 4 Announcement at Gamescom 2017

I loved the many speculations about what periods would have been covered. Personally i were pretty sure about the medieval times since the 2018 when i seen a “ a promotional internal video” by Relic (accidentally leaked and than removed due Copyright claims). It was a really short video (about 3 – 4 minutes) and some frames showed “motion captures with real horses, knights’s fights, first 3d renders of a medieval knights and some Relic staff who were visited a ancient chaple when a voice was saying “we travedeled a lot”

https://www.reddit.com/r/aoe4/comments/7ucq5n/leaked_motion_captures/
(i opened that thread on reddit)

3. Relic: personally i always like this Developers becaude they have produced two of the most important RTS in the history of this genre: Warhammer Dawn of War 1 and COH 1 and 2. Yes, DOW3 was a big failure because Relic tried to achieve different genres at the same times: MOBA and RTS, maybe following a wrong path. But there can always be a failure along the way.

4. During the X019 show, the trailer of Aoe4 was shown for the first time.

Age of Empires IV - X019 - Gameplay Reveal

This video was initially criticized for being too colourful, however you could see the epicness of the battles, the zoom out to dominate the battlefield (see the last frames) and the zoom in (already included in aoe3de and all games Relic except for DOW3) which allowed you to see battles more close for greater immersion and a cinematic sense (appreciated by casual gamers anyway).

Initially I wasn’t too happy with the colorful and playful graphic style, but Adam Isgreen’s reassurances about the options for saturation and the “behind the scenes” video reassured me.

Age of Empires IV: Behind the Scenes

I also opened a thread about that.

My apologize: this graphic is really amazing

I love it so much that now we will have different styles of uniforms for the same units for different civilizations, which AOE2 lacks.

So I haven’t always been a critic of the graphical aspects. In the end, from the AOE4 presentation video, everything seemed epic: the majestic buildings (with a very good scale), the imposing walls, the living city and the great battles and very good animations (see the arrows in this video). A new beginning for AOE that many fans would have liked.

What happened next?

In 2021, after two years of waiting, a show was finally announced to illustrate the state of AOE4 and I was very happy, as I think many of you.

I thought: if in 2019 they showed a pre-alpha version (which was already good) now the graphics will be great!!

Age of Empires IV - Gameplay Trailer

It was a shock not only for me but for so many fans too. What were we watching in that video?

Giant weapons that looked like plastic, low-res models, soulless maps and one of the ugliest UI ever seen in a RTS game. Everything seemed lifeless and without immersion.

The reactions to that video were really many: most people didn’t like the graphic style, the poor animations, the proportions of the buildings, the low resolution textures, the representation of the water. Initial reactions were “is this a mobile game”? Threads on reddit, and steam and youtube videos spread quickly.

Also on this forum there were many criticisms and most of these were collected in a huge thread opened by me and which became the main one on the game’s graphics.

PCGAMESN: people are worrying for the AOE4 graphic

Age of Empires fans are (still) mad about Age of Empires 4’s graphics | PCGamesN Oh ■■■■, i’m famous

[MERGED] Game Graphics Feedback

Ok, we have been waiting for a gameplay preview and i can Say: the art style Is so stupid and cartoonish… Low polished units: AOE3de Is much Better. I really don’t understand: 5 Years of development and Essence engine for this result? I have not words. Incredibile. This Will be a Great failure. Sorry but this Is not AOE. I’ll repost this video for a right comparison [ - YouTube]

What I remember is that there were tense discussions with several users and, for my part, I have always justified my observations using comparative graphs and screenshots.

The speech was not necessarily about the art style as much as the quality of the textures, the the building size, the animations and allof those criticisms that had already been discussed on the web.

Some people tried to justify this behind “graphic is not important”: only gameplay counts. But i always said that this statement was legit for e-sport players or for who often play in multiplayer mode. And this is a good prospetctive for those players.

But the most of players were casuals and “the graphic immersion” with deep and narrative campaigns (AOE saga always had these kind of campaigns and missions) non era presente in AOE4.

We were started from the X019’s presentation to arrive to that video who broke all of hype of many fans.

A sort of embarace was clear on the face of Developers (Adam Isgreen) when interviewers asked him why of that graphic.

We were started from what seen in the X019’s presentation (i remember you, a pre-alpha) to what showed during the AOE’s preview show. There was a really downgrade.

What the reasons behind this, in my opinion?

1. Relic never worked on this type of RTS. They made very good RTS which play in different ways in comparison to AOE. And watching different video interviews they said to play AOE2 a lot to understand the meaning of AOE.

So, i can understand that Relic was the only rts developer with a good experience, good portfolio and a team available to develop a new installment in this saga but i think (and this is my opinion) that Creative Assembly would have been the best developer for a medieval game: great battles, great graphic engine and a possibile dynamic map for a new generation experience;

2. It seems that a only a few part of the AOE’s Council had a certain role during the development’s way despite what developers said. Why i’m saying this?

Because it’s hard for to think that all of memeber of that Council gave to developers those bad suggestions: giant weapons, small buildings, low textures, poor gaia, low detailed biomas and poor of life (in comparison to AOM, AOE3).

After almost two years of developement and several patches we have only 3/4 animals for all biomas: it’s ridicoulus. Nothing have been changed abou that.

I have to sorry with Andy due my several discussions with him during the “merged graphic thread”. How many words we spent? But after the Aoe4’s release i understood that Andy had the same opinion of many fans like me : "AOE4 doesn’t have the same features or the same “graphic majesty” of the latest AOE games or their personality (AOEO didn’t have the same graphic of AOM or AOE3 but a lot of care in all of the aspects of the game: from the “living home city” to “the many missions around the ancient world”).

Speaking with Andy along this two years it seems that many suggestions from Council have been collected by Relic but they not implemented they into the final game.

So, what kind of players into the Council have been listened most? The answer brings to the next point;

Speaking with Andy along this two years (i’m referring to his perplexity about UI, graphic, gaia, biomas, game’s personality and more) it seems that manysuggestions from Council have been collected by Relic but they not implemented most of them into the game.

So, what kind of players into the Council have been listened most? The answer brings to the next point;

3. E-Sport: AOE4 have been development thinking to e-sport and tournments related. This explains:

a. the giant weapons and the small buildings due the readability;

b. the limited “zoom in” (it had been available during the alpha closed test, i rememeber well and it allowed to you to see the units more close) because multiplayers fans don’t play watching the battles in this way. But it means, on the other hand, that Immersion doesn’t matter;

c; all the tournments launched since the release of the first beta version.

Furthermore, the “e-sport vision” behind AOE4 have been well explained into the “artbook”

So, at the end of history, after almost two years:

1. there were updates about this game? Sure, i can’t say the opposite. Developers tried to their best, i’m sure about that;

2. Are those updates an answers to casual players? No, i suppose. We had two new civilizations without new campaigns or dedicated missions. This is useless for those players who are interested to more immersion living a narrated history.

3. the most of updates are related to balance for multiplayer matches and this is the main critics that i seen arounf the web.

What is the current state about the graphic after the latest big patch?

I have to say that developeres have totally re-made some textures, in particular the mountains now appear in really HD textures. So, well done about it.

And also some aspects of the terrain look better.

What could we say about the other aspects of the graphic?

Nothing have been changed. We have the same low textures for the most of units despite the request for some updates for them, the same plastic weapons, the same ugly animations and water.

Some examples:

UNITS (note, i have to move on the highlands beacuse developers have not implemented a better zoom in to see the units closer)

Sincerly, when i see those spears i think to MIKADO:

It’s not realistic for AOE

Water:

1. Beautiful for the rivers

2. horrible for the sea

Animations: always the ugly arrows

UI:

Hi all, this will be a long thread on disappointments and some hopes for the actual version and about Aoe4 future.

Shortly, i had very high expectactions about the new installment in the AOE serie: are were not waiting for 15 long years since the AOE3 launch?

What were the reasons behind my expecations? I suppose the same of the most of you:

1. the first announcment at gamescom 2017 and the renovate XBOX efforts on this legendary franchise: 2017 was the 20th anniversary of the Aoe. During the Gamescom was streamed the live show fo the future of AOE. How many incredible moments there: AAOE2 and AOE3 definitive editions were announced https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iI_bFPIYfbY

2. the first announcment of the AOE4: the live reactions were amazing

Age of Empires 4 Announcement at Gamescom 2017

I loved the many speculations about what periods would have been covered. Personally i were pretty sure about the medieval times since the 2018 when i seen a “ a promotional internal video” by Relic (accidentally leaked and than removed due Copyright claims). It was a really short video (about 3 – 4 minutes) and some frames showed “motion captures with real horses, knights’s fights, first 3d renders of a medieval knights and some Relic staff who were visited a ancient chaple when a voice was saying “we travedeled a lot”

https://www.reddit.com/r/aoe4/comments/7ucq5n/leaked_motion_captures/

3. Relic: personally i always like this Developers becaude they have produced two of the most important RTS in the history of this genre: Warhammer Dawn of War 1 and COH 1 and 2. Yes, DOW3 was a big failure because Relic tried to achieve different genres at the same times: MOBA and RTS, maybe following a wrong path. But there can always be a failure along the way.

4. During the X019 show, the trailer of Aoe4 was shown for the first time.

Age of Empires IV - X019 - Gameplay Reveal

This video was initially criticized for being too colourful, however you could see the epicness of the battles, the zoom out to dominate the battlefield (see the last frames) and the zoom in (already included in aoe3de and all games Relic except for DOW3) which allowed you to see battles more close for greater immersion and a cinematic sense (appreciated by casual gamers anyway).

Initially I wasn’t too happy with the colorful and playful graphic style, but Adam Isgreen’s reassurances about the options for saturation and the “behind the scenes” video reassured me.

Age of Empires IV: Behind the Scenes

I also opened a thread about that.

My apologize: this graphic is really amazing

I love it so much that now we will have different styles of uniforms for the same units for different civilizations, which AOE2 lacks.

So I haven’t always been a critic of the graphical aspects. In the end, from the AOE4 presentation video, everything seemed epic: the majestic buildings (with a very good scale), the imposing walls, the living city and the great battles and very good animations (see the arrows in this video). A new beginning for AOE that many fans would have liked.

What happened next?

In 2021, after two years of waiting, a show was finally announced to illustrate the state of AOE4 and I was very happy, as I think many of you.

I thought: if in 2019 they showed a pre-alpha version (which was already good) now the graphics will be great!!

Age of Empires IV - Gameplay Trailer

It was a shock not only for me but for so many fans too. What were we watching in that video?

Giant weapons that looked like plastic, low-res models, soulless maps and one of the ugliest UI ever seen in a RTS game. Everything seemed lifeless and without immersion.

The reactions to that video were really many: most people didn’t like the graphic style, the poor animations, the proportions of the buildings, the low resolution textures, the representation of the water. Initial reactions were “is this a mobile game”? Threads on reddit, and steam and youtube videos spread quickly.

Also on this forum there were many criticisms and most of these were collected in a huge thread opened by me and which became the main one on the game’s graphics.

PCGAMESN: people are worrying for the AOE4 graphic

Age of Empires fans are (still) mad about Age of Empires 4’s graphics | PCGamesN Oh ■■■■, i’m famous

[MERGED] Game Graphics Feedback

Ok, we have been waiting for a gameplay preview and i can Say: the art style Is so stupid and cartoonish… Low polished units: AOE3de Is much Better. I really don’t understand: 5 Years of development and Essence engine for this result? I have not words. Incredibile. This Will be a Great failure. Sorry but this Is not AOE. I’ll repost this video for a right comparison [ - YouTube]

What I remember is that there were tense discussions with several users and, for my part, I have always justified my observations using comparative graphs and screenshots.

The speech was not necessarily about the art style as much as the quality of the textures, the the building size, the animations and allof those criticisms that had already been discussed on the web.

Some people tried to justify this behind “graphic is not important”: only gameplay counts. But i always said that this statement was legit for e-sport players or for who often play in multiplayer mode. And this is a good prospetctive for those players.

But the most of players were casuals and “the graphic immersion” with deep and narrative campaigns (AOE saga always had these kind of campaigns and missions) non era presente in AOE4.

We were started from the X019’s presentation to arrive to that video who broke all of hype of many fans.

A sort of embarace was clear on the face of some of developers (Adam Isgreen) when interviewers asked them why of that graphic.

We were started from what seen in the X019’s presentation (i remember you, a pre-alpha) to what showed during the AOE’s preview show. There was a really downgrade.

What the reasons behind this, in my opinion?

1. Relic never worked on this type of RTS. They made very good RTS which play in different ways in comparison to AOE. And watching different video interviews they said to play AOE2 a lot to understand the meaning of AOE.

So, i can understand that Relic was the only rts developer with a good experience, good portfolio and a team available to develop a new installment in this saga but i think (and this is my opinion) that Creative Assembly would have been the best developer for a medieval game: great battles, great graphic engine and a possibile dynamic map for a new generation experience;

2. It seems that a only a few part of the AOE’s Council had a certain role during the development’s way despite what developers said. Why i’m saying this?

Because it’s hard for to think that all of memeber of that Council gave to developers those bad suggestions: giant weapons, small buildings, low textures, poor gaia, low detailed biomas and poor of life (in comparison to AOM, AOE3).

After almost two years of developement and several patches we have only 3/4 animals for all biomas: it’s ridicoulus. Nothing have been changed abou that.

I have to sorry with Andy due my several discussions with him during the “merged graphic thread”. How many words we spent? But after the Aoe4’s release i understood that Andy had the same opinion of many fans like me : "AOE4 doesn’t have the same features or the same “graphic majesty” of the latest AOE games or their personality (AOEO didn’t have the same graphic of AOM or AOE3 but a lot of care in all of the aspects of the game: from the “living home city” to “the many missions around the ancient world”).

Speaking with Andy along this two years it seems that many suggestions from Council have been collected by Relic but they not implemented they into the final game.

So, what kind of players into the Council have been listened most? The answer brings to the next point;

So, what kind of players into the Council have been listened most? The answer brings to the next point;

3. E-Sport: AOE4 have been development thinking to e-sport and tournments related. This explains:

• the giant weapons and the small buildings due the readability;

• the limited “zoom in” (it had been available during the alpha closed test, i rememeber well and it allowed to you to see the units more close) because multiplayers fans don’t play watching the battles in this way. But it means, on the other hand, that Immersion doesn’t matter;

• all the tournments launched since the release of the first beta version.

Furthermore, the “e-sport vision” behind AOE4 have been well explained into the “artbook”

So, at the end of history, after almost two years:

1. there were updates about this game? Sure, i can’t say the opposite. Developers tried to their best, i’m sure about that;

2. Are those updates an answers to casual players? No, i suppose. We had two new civilizations without new campaigns or dedicated missions. This is useless for those players who are interested to more immersion living a narrated history.

3. the most of updates are related to balance for multiplayer matches.

What is the current state about the graphic after the latest big patch?

I have to say that developeres have totally re-made some textures, in particular the mountains now appear in really HD textures. So, well done about it.

And also some aspects of the terrain look better.

What could we say about the other aspects of the graphic?

Nothing have been changed. We have the same low textures for the most of units despite the request for some updates for them, the same plastic weapons, the same ugly animations and water.

Some examples:

UNITS (note, i have to move on the highlands beacuse developers have not implemented a better zoom in to see the units closer)

Sincerly, when i see those spears i think to MIKADO snacks:

It’s not realistic for AOE. Some comparison with AOE3de

Water:

1. Beautiful for the rivers

2. horrible for the sea

AOE3de

Animations: always the ugly arrows

UI and Menù Interface

It think this is the worst UI that i ever seen. Soulsless and without personality and colours

AOE3de

ZOOM IN and ZOOM OUT

The first time I played the closed alpha (NDA, so I can’t say more) there was a great “zoom in” that allowed you to see units and battles up close to appreciate the battles by increasing the immersion, also thanks to the spectacular sound.

To my surprise, after the first beta versions, this option had been reduced with the “zoom level” we have now in this version of the game. As a result, you will never get to see the battles up close (I had to place up troops in the mountains to post screenshots in this thread).

This is a strange choice to me because it seems to be an answer only for the multiplayers fans. It brokes the immersion during the skirmish and campaigns. Developers said that AOE should give to gamers the sensation of “living history”: please, give this feeling. Actually AOE4 seems poor in many ways.

The probably reasons behind this:

1. E-sport: multiplayer fans were very vocal about this and returning to what i said about the AOE’s Council, they were the members to be listened the most. They said "readabilty, readability, readability". Ok, but readabilty it’s not improved now;

AOE3de seems to reach a very good equilibrium: great graphic with a cinematic zoom in + good readability

2. The low textures details: this is one of the most critized aspect about the game not only by many fans but also by differents professional reviewers and interviewers. Limiting the zoom in prevents other criticicims by fans who could say the textures are ugly.

The criticims to the graphic seem legit and it could be a reason about the recent updates (see the screenshots about mountains) by developers. However also the textures models, building and waters need the same treatment.

In the same time, Aoe3de continues to add new historical units very well detailed (these are from the upcoming patch)

AOE4 recevied only few new units with the new big patch. There are not “single player contents”;

The Buildings size

this is another argument discussed a lot. There was a drastic change between what we seen in X019 trailer and the actual game version. We didn’t see any updates about it.

These are not the original sizes and they are degrading the immersion and also the quality graphic of the buildings themself

[jimmy19846071]

what i would like to see for the future

1. Graphic DLC should include new animations, option for blood and corpes (there aren’t mods for this), a new weapons representation (Aoe3de could be a right example), new textures for more polished unit models (the new textures added with the latest patch are the right way to follow, in my opinion), more and different GAIA and FAUNA. Options to change the buildings size and the zoom in (Aoe3e3 is the same good example);

2. Dynamic world Map (with a representation of the europe and Asia): relic acquired a good experience with this mode thanks to COH3 and the helpful contribution by Creative Assembly, creator of Total War (Yes, Relic and Creative Assembly are both under SEGA). This is a very good mode for everyone who wanna play singleplayer for two reasons:

• you have the real sensation to conquer the medieval world. Every mission is represented on the dynamic map as a logical or necessary step to follow to complete the main campaign. Imagine total war with skirmish or "different missions (defend places, conquest some fortess, lead villagers to a safe location, etc.). Infinite possibilities to play;

• this modality offers hundred hours of singleplayer also with co-op.

This is one of the most beatiful adds into COH3

Company of Heroes 3 Developer Diary // Campaign - YouTube;

3. New UI Graphic

This is another controversial argument but developers didn’t improve it yet.

The main problem is not how many informations or stats have been inclueded but how they have been rapresented.

Actually, the UI seems aseptic in particular for the unit icons. Also in this case, AOE3de could be a good example to follow up

4. New skins for units and Historical missions and a better diplomacy Options like this:

Asking for troops, coordinate attack, what produce and which strategy to follow. In AOE3 you can tell to your CPU Allies to adopt a economic or a defensive strategy, for example.

All of these request could be a good base for all of players who love the campaigns or skirmish.

Developers are doing a good work for e-sport and multiplayer aspects:

Now, it’s time to listen also the other voice of fans: the casual players.

I’m pretty sure there will be something to announce at Gamescom 2023 beside the “AOM retold”. I don’t know what developers are preparing for us, probably on or two more civilizations. The main important thing imho, is that all the new adds should be followed by graphic improvements (animations and textures).

However The recent lay-off of many Relic developers don’t make me so confident about the future so i’m really curious to see what’s coming on.

SPECULATIONS

1. How AOE4 had could been

reading the AOe4’s art book i found beatiful artwork and renders of the inizial stage of the game development:

• exploring map and reliques

• naval warfare bases or docks;

• Menu Interface (much better than the actual one, imho);

• maximum zoom out

• 3d render of medieval Knight (this is the graphic that i was waiting when i see the name of developers during the first announcment teaser - Gamescom 2017)

I’ve read some users talking about AOE5 and the historical era it will cover. I don’t know if there will be a new AOE (I hope so, of course) or who will develop it (Relic, Creative Assembly, Tantalus+Forgotten) but what I would really like to see would be a new game set in ancient times. Playing with the Italians in AOE3de, the beautiful representation of the Roman legionnaire with lorica armour

makes me dream for a new AOE with Romans, Greeks, Persians, Macedonians and, hopefully, a new generation graphic .

Thanks and good luck to the Relic team.

I made several grammat mistakes, so sorry, but it’s a very long thread.

Cheers, Jimmy

[HasanIchess]

“Now, it’s time to listen also the other voice of fans: the casual players.”

Colour selection
map ban
panoramic camera
siege nerf
2 civilizations
remappable hotkeys
new maps
most unique units
occlusion

I don’t know what world you live in, content for casuals has always been a priority, while those of us who are waiting for improvements in hotkeys, in the reproduction of saved games and in the balance, receive crumbs

[jimmy19846071]

@HasanIchess

Colour selection
map ban
panoramic camera
siege nerf
2 civilizations
remappable hotkeys
new maps
most unique units
occlusion

Except for 2 civilizations and the occlusion (almost two years) the other adds are the minimum for every RTS at launch. So i don’t Say “new adds for casual players”.

[KG19991380]

correction, occlusion is also a basic feature that shouldn’t need a post launch patch, also hasan is a tad too blind to see that remap hotkeys, map bans, siege nerf and new maps have more to do with the competitive players while being beneficial to at least some casual ones as opposed to being “casual player feedback”

[HasanIchess]

I’m going to use your words: a good Meta without games, stuck for 3 hours is the minimum that an RTS should have at launch

[Croissantini]

This post highlights a lot of things that sadly goes forgotten as the attention shifts from one thing to another, yet not because those individual things get resolved. Just because of the tremendous amount of things that are wrong with this awful, awful development.

Honestly, the studio must’ve exploded or something. Something must’ve just gone incredibly wrong.

Look at how genuine that conceptual UI looks compared to this lazy website-looking UI that we got. Look at the exploration of assets, of construction like water walls and gates.

It honestly strikes me as that the game was meant to be in the oven for more than just another year. You might ask, well, we are 2 years into post-launch now and it doesn’t look all that different. But, the game has not been kept up by an actual development team. These micro patches we are getting can be put together by a handful of people. The exception are the new civilization patches. The thing is with those is that, you don’t need a whole development team to make singular civilizations and biomes. As much effort as those take, it is a far cry from the effort required to further innovate on mechanics, create more visual assets, animations and further develop styles, UI and so on.

So yea, no wonder they keep their mouths shut. The game is an obvious travesty from what it was meant to be. We’ll never know which vulture caused this of course, they are immune to all forms of criticism. And mind you, I’m not blaming the developers, hence we don’t know what caused this mess. Whether it was managerial in nature or higher up.

I’ve tried to not be too negative until we see an actual content patch in a few months. Who knows how much they can turn around? But, there is this bitter bitter skeptic in me that tells me it will just be a copy-paste of the last year. And as much as I enjoyed 2 civilizations, that is just not enough to remedy the complete train wreck state that the game is still in.

[TsudaTumiko]

Lesson learned, never trust Adam Isgren or Relic again…also funny to see that mods close that thread, the most important one in this forum lol

[CagierNebula24]

Lots of good stuff here.

I prefer the UI on 4 to 3. Love the blue and gold, so nice to look at, so easy to read. Love the shading, contrast, colors.

And when I see the little gold pic of a target I KNOW that’s an archery range. It’s so easy.

Love the rock-paper-scissors on 4 too. Much easier to use correctly (the right unit for the fight). Most of the time in 3 I just macro and hope for the best.

[TsudaTumiko]

The 2 civs have no campaign BTW…

Someday or they probably know already, eSports are like 1-3% of players, reducing graphics and animations for esports is one way to lower your player base, specially on an RTS…

[_e_o_ka]

Well very honestly and unfortunately, I have to 100% agree with you.
You ask, how could this happen?
Well, I’d say the game received a super minimal budget.
Probably 10% of what it should have received to reach the quality which was promised in the big advertisements and as a part of the glorious aoe series which was always amazing, innovative and visually stunning and ahead of its time, all of the previous ones. Aoe1, aoe2, aom and aoe3.
Aoe4 seems like an alpha state, a game that has not reached beta state yet and was abandoned in its developement.

[CagierNebula24]

The developers for 3 said, ‘one of our goals was to be the best looking game on the market’.

They made it.

[AndyPXIII]

I assume the budget was sufficient. I ascribe the failure to it being spent by franchise outsiders who didn’t know what they didn’t know.

It always felt to me that the game was designed at Stage 1. I bet it was released at Stage 2. I assume that two years out and without a roadmap in sight, we are now at Stage 4.

Bringing in franchise experts Forgotten Empires, even if only as a sounding board, is an easy way to begin the climb to Stage 5.

As illustrated in the graph, I look forward to the next game.

[Coranhon1]

To keep those oversimplified and minimalist icons for units I can not acknowledge that they left the first stages. Ottomans and Malians were a great step to recover but… They failed just in the details, you can have soul in the tiny things. An example? Look to the topic comparing the idle/boring animations from AoE1 OG units to Aoe1DE and Return of Rome, silly things matter and Aoe4 felt like they listened to every idea but used a blender for the worst of all?
Imagine a kid that used to draw military buildings or units but now you don’t have this possibility because the charm is gone?
The only novelty that is unique is the crowd sound while you grow your town.
It’s time to devs create some fauna for this game too.

[LowApartment190]

I personally think that updates are way too small in size, and this problem is further enhanced by a “major” update being released only every four months. I made a separate post about my AoE4 wishlist, which is quite extensive but still shortened from what I had initially planned to post. Taking a look at the most recent update, I personally only like the new unique units, the performance upgrade, and obviously the bug fixes. The problem is, though, that this is almost all of what was released in the update, besides a new game mode and team voice chat. This is simply not enough for every four months, and I do not see myself playing the game regularly for another few years if this trend of slow and small updates continues.

[SamuelWallace17]

I can’t agree more about this, although AOE4 has its own advance, AOE3 does do better than it in many aspects.

1.AOE4 does lacking of historical details, which make AOE4 looks rough in too many ways.
Like why English king holding a twohanded zweihänder with single hand?
Why oriental spearman holding a European guisarme? (They even made Chinese halberd without using it)
Are there only these types of animals around the world?

2.The reduction of the AOE4’s building does harm the realism of the graphics.
But I don’t think this is very easy to solve because the size of the building has already incorporated the issue of balance.
Perhaps we can only improve this by reducing the size of the units or modifying the building model.

3.AOE4 is lacking of the physical effects of artillery bombardment.
I known this is nearly impossible to improve, I just feel great when I using those falconet in AOE3.

[jimmy19846071]

Yes, we are probably in the middle of that path.
As i said Relic never developed this type of RTS and It was a great challenge for them.

We’ll see what Forgetten make to change this situation.

[jimmy19846071]

@Carry_Potter_woll

Well, I’d say the game received a super minimal budget

I think Relic had a very good budget but they spent It badly: too much documentaries and no narrative campaigns, Better animations and graphic, IA, biomas and more.

[jimmy19846071]

Agree with all of these asepcts

[AndyPXIII]

The devs took a trip to England to look at castles and put a mocap suit on a horse and then forgot to put castles in the civs and gave every civ the same horse.

You will recall that AoE2 calls its third age the Castle Age because that’s exactly when you can build the castle, which is the capstone building in each civ and trains the unique units.

AoE4 inexplicably doesn’t have castles yet calls its third age the Castle Age because, um, because that’s what AoE2 calls it. Its diet soda version is called a keep and doesn’t train anything. My god I can’t wait until Stage 5.