[NEWS]: New Patch in late January or Early February: Ideas for Balance before the release

Age of Empires IV IV - Discussion
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- NEW MINOR PATCH IS COMING IN FEW WEEKS?

I just wanted to announce that as some streamers commented, and was revealed in the Hotfix 9.1.404, a New patch is coming for this last week of January or the first weeks of February.

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According to the streamers, there is “a lot of balance” and some say that they think the solution they propose seems “beautiful.” Although I usually say that only time will tell, well, at least I think that there are many thing that need to be considered:

  • 1.- Zhu Xi.- is very broken in feudal, its early rush is too broken, and at least I think many think that some of the early economic bonuses they have could be nerfed (Tang: 15% - > 10%, Song bonus: 40% → 30%) to balance them with the rest of the civs, but nothing more serious.

  • 2.- Byzantines.- they deserve some extra advantage to be able to take off in Feudal and to be able to better use the mercenaries (which count as their 5th extra feudal unit, which all civs have one).

  • 3.- Japanese.- There are 2 bugs: One is visual, of the Mounted Samurai who attack with the blunt side of their katanas. The 2nd is the most serious: The Onna-Musha is not receiving an attack bonus from either Uma Bannerman or Yumi Bannerman, it is not receiving any, and I do not think it is intentional, because the unit lights up and a message as if it received it, but it does not receive it, so it is practically a BUG. ( Japanese onnamusha do not recieve bonus from banner)

  • 4.- Rest of Civs.- In general I had already suggested in another topic that many other classic civs would benefit from new unique units or extra mechanics to match in power with some variants (Suggestion: New Units and Mechanics to Classic Civs - January 2024). This especially the “Civ-fathers” in post-imperial (“French, Chinese, Abbasid, Holy Roman Empire”). However, for that change of unique units I suppose we would have to wait for the change of season, perhaps March or the next season, whichever is better for the devs to develop good models, but hey, i am still optimistic, still loving this game.

Any additional comments? It would be good to report any bugs or opinions in order to better balance the game.

Take care.

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Fix ranked matchmaking!

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Byzantines should indeed be buffed and an idea I had in mind was reducing the Food cost of the Limitanei from 80 to 70.

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I would also add Ayubids fast castle. That wing needs some serious changes! No civ should be able to get to age3 so quick!

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Notice that Ayyubids are already OP and because of that, they must get some nerfs.

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Glad to see more players notice the visual mistake in this game, like Mounted Samurai’s weapon, or Yuan Rider’s iron right hand, and more, we’re hoping they can gradually solve those ridiculous problems.

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As the Ayyubids are to be balanced, let’s also remove their access to the Battering Ram and Siege Tower because their unique siege unit, the Tower of the Sultan, is pretty much a combination of both units as the Tower of the Sultan fulfills the role of both of them.

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Lol … Do u realze how shitty Tower of the Sultan is? Its so bad it was never actually used by high-elo players.
By this simple change u would completely but completely remove some II age aggro possibilities from Ayuubids.

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I think the matchmaking should be less aggressive in the search and in team games they should fix some things (by players increasing the elo to the partner, having a lower elo).

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The entire community seems unified in wanting Zhu Xi nerfed. I think the suggested nerfs to Tang and Song are sensible and would see where you get to with that. (I might nerf Song even down to 25%).

I think Byzantines are in a weird spot where they definitely feel bad at the outset - but any significant buff is going to make them instantly OP. The civ probably needs quite material rebalancing if they are going to boost the early game. I think Japan is in a similar boat. I certainly wouldn’t buff any units.

I know its the reddit meme and Beasty etc say its fine - but I’d still nerf JD. Maybe this would be too much, but having it so she can’t go level 3 without them hitting Castle/level 4 without Imperial would seem reasonable to me. Or increase the XP requirement to level up. Right now in Poker terms I feel she is just French but with more outs. She acts a second wind precisely when regular French tempo would be falling off - which unsurprisingly produces better results across the ladder.

There could be broader buffs - but some of this is map dependent. I don’t think for instance that Abbasid is that bad - but feel the current pool of ladder maps are not good for the civ. Its the same as with HRE and China. If you can survive for 20 minutes you are in a reasonable spot - but so much can go wrong. You are also very dependent on spawn - with a huge difference between having food/gold forward as opposed to behind your TC.

I’m tempted to say Ayyubids needs a complete re-work. I’m not sure the current system can ever be balanced. The super fast castle timing should I think be nerfed. But if you take that away I’m not sure what would be left.

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Oh shit! I really didn’t know.

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No problem brother :slight_smile:

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I made a post before previous patch with siggested balance changes (ignoring bugs).

Here is what i suggested (updated for last patch)

Japanese
Budhist Temple Landmark: Now also spawns 2 free monks upon completion.
Budhist Monk Sohei’s Sutra Ability: Now works a bit better at being casted automatically, by prioritizing high-damage targets and prioritizing the skill over healing during battles.
Note: At the moment, shinto is always better no matter the strategy you go for. Giving 2 monk for free would make this landmark useful when trying to contest relics, like if playing against hre, while shinto would remain the landmark of choice with other strategies).

Byzantine
Grand Winery: Unlock training of monks in the feudal age. Can research wheelbarrow.
Cistern of first hill provides 2 water levels.

Jeanne D’Arc
Reviving her with gold now takes 20 seconds of queue time in the TC.
Reviving ability cost and time gets a discounted based on how close you are from her reviving for free (if you waited 50% of the time, she is revived at 50% of the cost and in 10 sec).
Jeanne range damage reduction, reduced from 50 to 30% at level 3, and from 66 to 50% at level 4.

Ayyubids
Casino wing:
Increase number of available trade from 4 to 5.

Military Wing blacksmith: Now also researches all blacksmith research from previous age (not only the current age).

Tower of sultan: Cost reduced from 650/350 to 550/250

Fast age up: Instead of always 40% less time to research. Take 10% less time in feudal, 25% less in castle, and 50% less in imperial. Cost same as before.

Zhu Xi legacy
Shaolin Monks HP reduced from 170 to 150
Song dynasty does not apply to defensive building (outpost/walls). Song dynasty discount reduced from 40% to 30%.
Meditation Garden resources production is now reduced by 20% per nearby enemy unit instead of 10% (so you only need 5 units nearby to completely negate it)

Order of the Dragon
Archen chapel can now train monk in feudal
Archen chapel can now hold 1 relic, when it does, the aura gathering rate is increased to 15% instead of 10%. (Relic still generates gold.)
War horses: War horses now lasts for 3 seconds after the charge as well, instead of just during the charge.

Old Civs

Ottoman
Janissary bonus damage against cavalry reduced from 16 to 10
Jannissary gun tech increase damage by +5 instead of +3.
Sea Gate Castle comes with a free great bombard emplacement.

Note: Janissaries make cavalry completely obsolete and in current format you just can’t use cavalry at all against ottoman jani. This change goal is to make Janissaries a bit more versatile, while still countering cavalry, but without completely annihilating them. The improved imperial age tech should make them slightly more similar to handcannoner in imperial in terms of attack. The effective change in imperial is -4 against cavalry but +2 against other units.

Delhi
Zeal ability increase the attack speed for 7 seconds instead of 3.

HRE
Burgrave palace spawn 3 landsknetch for free upon completion

Mongol
Mongol can now build wood walls in imperial age, after researching the Pax Mongolica tech.

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I don’t really get why ootd and byzantines should make monks in age 2. They can’t do anything with them except healing.

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I just think its a nice bonus for choosing the religious landmark, its a bit weird to have a landmark built in age 2 but then the monk are locked until age 3, also those 2 landmark are too weak right now.
The adventage is that you can start training them earlier and position them near relic so you can pick them as soon as you hit age 3.

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I think of the cost of the Tower of the Sultan seems fine. Ayyubids could still use Battering Rams and Siege Towers if they can’t afford the Tower of the Sultan.

It be nice to add to the list, reducing the Limitanei food cost from 80 to either 75 or 70.

Janissaries should also have their HP increased from 90/105 to 115/130.

Mongols will also need a buff to their Keshik because right now, the Keshik is quite weak.

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Byzantine are already very strong in late game, i don’t think limitenei cost is an issue. They are already one of the most made unit. I don’t see what it’s solving. the keshik are well balanced in my opinion, they are cheaper and much easier to mass. And everyone uses them.

Tower of sultan is NOT used and i think it’s important to balance the game so that all units are useful.

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The player sorting within ranked team games can be greatly improved.
It seems like many times the top players end up on team 1 and the bottom half on team 2.

I know match making has nothing to do with rank (MMR), I know it is based on the underlying ELO for the mode (i.e. one for 2v2, one for 3v3 and one for 4v4). I also know that some teams are premade, but even when taking all this under consideration there can be greatly unfair games.

Here is a fresh example from yesterday, a game shown on Twitch from Mokomi, a Team Game streamer: Mokomi’s Game – AoE4 World
Twitch - Twitch

In the game shown player 4v4 team ranked ELO at the time of the game:

Team 1: Mokomi (1548), BearFriendly (1293), nannelund (1130) and simbax (1374)

Team 2: Flyan (1150), 厚德载物 (1122), XQC (1183) and Niko (1152)

Mokomi’s team 4v4 average is 1336 ELO vs the opponents 1152 ELO, an almost 200 difference, a very shitty match up imo.

Mokomi was teamed with BearFriendly and Flyan was teamed with 厚德载物.
I know this because I watched the stream and then did research on aoe4world.
The search time was 5.20 before Mokomi found his game.

Obviously game can’t split the two friend groups but regardless the single conq Simbax (1374) should have been on the other team, e.g. switch team with XQC.

I am guessing (1) the game either forgets original ELO when players queue for a long time or (2) game randoms the chosen players/groups within a match, ignoring their ELO or (3) game puts the people who searched the longest in 1 team first, which results in all the high elo ones in one team.

Whatever, the reason, this game goes to show that the algorithm CAN be improved by a simple sort once 8 players are picked, i.e. the single queuing conq should have been on the other team.

Fixing this would mean ALOT for team games, please PRIORITIZE this simple fix.

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when will the patch notes arrive?

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Usually with the patch release, either last week of January or first two weeks of February in this case.

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