Another day, another small pup update. What’s changed this time?
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PUP update
Ongoing general polish and fixes.
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Where can we see this update? I didn’t buy the game thru steam so steam won’t let me access the files
Ah that explains it. Some things were really one sided in the games i played lol.
Why has there been no changes to the new Dutch cards since the pup was first introduced?
Dutch States Army - Move to Age 4, reduce cost increase to 5%
Infantry Combat - change to affect all units with Infantry tag instead of dutch specific units
Buckriders - Highwaymen need an entire rework. Remove the 500 coin cost and move to Age 3. Buff base damage to 18, cut charged attack down to 28 base damage.
For the card specifically: remove the coin cost reduction, set population cost to 2 (since you don’t want theatres working with this card, this is better)
Please make these changes dutch seriously need these buffs for treaty.
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the ERKs were already weak enough against light infantry; they did not need to be weakened further. I find it reasonable to ask that ERKs be weaker against heavy infantry, especially musketeers. But not against skirmishers. many will say “but it is much better than the dragon against light infantry”, yes, but it is still bad against light infantry and the Aztecs lack cannons and grenadiers or some similar unit.
2 Likes
I hold my opinion personally and that of several high-level players. The trade wasn’t too bad with the ERKs. The problem of the Aztec meta in supremacy is another. We’ll see how it all turns out.
There has been a trend of balance changes that are seemingly being influenced by the bad opinions of popular streamers. I actually heard a top treaty streamer compare 50 ERK to 50 skirm with no micro as an example of why ERK are “broken”, as if that is anywhere near a fair comparison.
It appears that supremacy is being negatively impacted by the devs attempting to balance the game for treaty players. This was bound to become an issue at some point as long as both modes share the same unit stats and card effects. The game modes are played very differently and treaty negates many of the balancing factors that come into play in supremacy such as unit cost, early and mid game economies, map control advantages/disadvantages, housing costs, or raidability, just to name a few. If a civ has a relatively weaker economy, they need stronger units to compete, and without that proper context, it isn’t even appropirate to make equilviant res cost comparisons between ERK and skirms relative to goons.
Another victim of treaty balancing clearly seems to be healers getting nerfed. Not a single supremacy player seems to know why they are getting nerfed. They take an extaordinarily long time to create for their economic value. A healer takes 540 ville seconds to create and provides the economic equivilant of of 1.25 villes on the CP. After the patch it will be 1.2 villes. This is something that would only ever become a problem in treaty, as a healer boom in supremacy requires a significant investment that would leave the booming player vulnerable to attack. The game shouldn’t be so easy for native civs opponents that they neither need to raid them or push them during a boom. Imagine if people actually started utilizing spies to check for this, which are also good against Warchiefs.
The 4 healer card for Lakota and Haud is the equivilant of 5 villes on the Community Plaza. Lakota doesn’t get a ville card in age 2 or a church, so the 4 healer card is one of their best economic options in the early game for a long game strategy, esp on maps with limited TPs. Healers are one of the only ways Lakota and Haud can compete economically and I fail to understand how even a small nerf is warranted considering one of the failings of these civs are their late game economies, and their underrepresentation on the ladder.
Below I’ve listed the current values with and without medicine wheel with 10 healer and 15 villagers on the Community Plaza for Lakota. Most dances have diminishing returns. Only XP dance increases exponentially with more villes. Is every one of these dances really overperforming in supremacy to deserve a blanket nerf to Lakota and Haud? Medicine wheel will drop from from +50% to +35% bonus to healers after the patch.
Attack Dance
10 Healer/15 villes on Plaza +25%
10 Healer/15 villes on Plaza w/ Medicine Wheel +37%
Harvest Dance increased production speed for military, ville
10 Healer/15 villes on Plaza 390%, 133%
10 Healer/15 villes on Plaza w/ Medicine Wheel 560%, 166%
Siege
10 Healer/15 villes on Plaza 54%
10 Healer/15 villes on Plaza w/ Medicine Wheel 64%
Warchief
10 Healer/15 villes on Plaza +86, 1250+2764 HP
10 Healer/15 villes on Plaza w/ Medicine Wheel +107, 1250+3130 HP
XP Dance
10 Healer/15 villes on Plaza: +16.65 xp
10 Healer/15 villes on Plaza w/ Medicine Wheel: +21.88 xp
Healer Dance
10 Healer/15 villes on Plaza: 17s
10 Healer/15 villes on Plaza w/ Medicine Wheel: 13s
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I can’t find the date the PUP will go live, anyone have a date?
2 Likes
If this truly is the fabled Spring update then around the 21st. But nothing official yet.
IDK why they are compared to be better than a skirmisher if they are already pretty bad vs infantry having no multipliers and the cost of each EK is higher.
The only use for them is killing cav and they just function like dragoons having that resistance to ranged attacks.
They nerfed the only decent unit Aztecs have, aiming to balance treaties. But this nerf is general and will affect pretty bad to Aztecs in age 3-4 supremacy. At least their price has to be reduced to compensate.
hmm so italy get a steath buff against cav
will be interesting to see how this plays out since its better then before but still relatively bad all things considered
Not like Italy will perform any better. Bottom tier civ especially in treaty.
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Any plan to do anything with Meiji Restoration tech? It’s just useless there.
7 Likes
In my opinion, this technology should act like a revolution, i.e. the emergence of replacing some units with completely new ones - those from the Meiji Restoration era.
It would also be nice to have a visual effect when Meiji Restoration is selected - changing the flag. The Japanese civ flag in the game is Tokugawa Yorinobu Daimyō Banner:
I propose that when Meiji Restoration is selected, the Japanese civ flag should change to one of these two:
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Flag of the Japanese Emperor
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Flag of the Japanese Empire
1 Like
I have wrong values for victory ceremony in my previous post. 10 Healer/15 villes on Plaza is +30% damage and Medicine Wheel card makes it +37% (+7%)
A total of 13 different ceremonys will be negatively impacted by Healer nerf and medicine wheel nerf.
My suggestions for improvements to Italy in the Treaty (all changes (except for card) would not exist until the 5th Age and would therefore have no effect on Supremacy):
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Excessive Taxation from capitol increase build limit for lombards by 1 or 2 (like dutch do it with banks).
This would increase the economic power of the Italians, so that they can push from time to time without the resources dropping too much. -
Upgrade “Imperial papal Bombard” from factory: Besides the existing improvement, it also reduces the population from 8 to 7 and reduces the rate of fire from 7 (?!) seconds to 4 seconds, like the lil bombard. This would give the Italians better military strength in the endgame.
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Card “delivers 1 papal bombard” (infinite, age 4) → “delivers 1 papal bombard and 1 culverin” (infinite, age 4).
In this way, it would no longer be necessary to estimate in a complicated way that the culverins are produced at the same time as the papal bombardment are delivered, so that the culverin benefit optimally from the damage absorption. -
Reduced delivery time for Imperial Age Papal units (from basilica) and/or better stats and/or more units are delivered and/or the units require less population.
3 Likes
Another pup update today. What changed this time? And can we have patch notes when updates drop?