God forbid that in an rts the player with better macro and micro wins 11
2 Likes
No, it is not
Depending on the situation
In order:
- Trush has always been perceived as a cheese build. Yeah, trush used to be stronger in previous patches, but generally speaking you went trush when the civ match up you got was bad, simply because it gave you a way better chance than going for a straight up macro game. This has been done for a long time since voobly. So, the first reason people dislike it is that is a cheese (like the cannon rush in SC2)
- Tower rushing requires way less micro and macro to be performed than basically any other strat. It is way easier to do than to defend an it depends a lot on how the map spawn (way more than other openings)
- People want to play with units. The counter to towers in feudal is more towers. If you are not playing against someone really bad he can probably afford towers to defend himself at home, making it really hard to punish him, which means that by trushing you are forcing only one counterplay and slowing the game
- Especially at low elo (and kid you not, 1k is low elo), people do not know how to properly respond to a trush. It is already frustrating to play against it when you know what to do, imagine if you do not
- As said above, it is a cheese, and like all cheese builds it inflates your elo. A good example of this is Hoang, who outside of his all in pushes with full market is not even remotely a 2k4 player. Another good example is Salicum, that with the Inca rush peaked a 2174 elo and now is 1690 elo, or Noboru, that peaked a 2117 and now is 1707
By no means this strat should not be allowed, it is something that is in the game, it is ok to do it and sometimes is your only way out of a terrible match up (make it messy, gain position forward and all in the opponent in castle). Hell, literally my last 1v1 was a man at arms + tower opening because i scouted two shitty stones and because it was cumans (my opponent) vs magyars on gold rush, so i had to do something different.
But it remains a cheese and a build that is simply not fun to play against. You cannot ask people to give you a gg, especially when you seem to be a otp that straight up plays only the best civ for a trush atm.
It is as bad and as cheesy as the old noboru rush (inca rush, if you will)? No. Is it something fun to play against? No. People should be giving you a gg if they did not feel like it was a good game? No
4 Likes
Bro poles are among the most OP civs at the Moments, while sicilians are average tier, and they are getting heavily nerfed as well with no compensation. Really unfair comparison there lol
Well tbf It’s surprisingt that poles haven’t been nerfed as a whole not just tower rushing
btw, just a reminder that I proposed a change to that like one year ago:
nope, not at all. since you’re not fighting all the time and always doing things with those vills the HP adds up very quickly. not only it requires less micro from you, it also forces other player to switch out villagers who are low on health, or risk losing low hp vills, thus more work for the opponent.
it is such a huge advantage. honestly wouldn’t mind to have the regen kick in after castle age but this will probably lead to big rage like what they did with incas vill
2 Likes
Developers hate the tower rush too
If you have 1 vil and 1 mangonel and resources, you can bite 100 towers with garrisoned enemy vils cuz:
also tons of tower bug:
Tower attacked the mangonel instead of repairer villager - #9 by HeBroGaming (It seems not bug anymore?)
1 Like
TWest also just made a video how modri stopped a drush from dracken on arena:
And btw if even top Arena players struggle to find strats vs trushes the argument of “it’s so easy to stop” actually doesn’t really hold. Cause even if you know “how” you might struggle with circumstances (like in this example the late uptime to feudal) or might have executional problems if you eg don’t have experience where and how to backwall, where to place your countertower. When to rush down the enemy towers. When to counterraid …
That’s what makes the strat kinda “toxic” in around 1k elo. I think it’s nothing wrong about trushing at 1k2 + elo, players at this level should learn how to deal with that. But below that level it’s not good manners to cheese that strat.
I proposed a time ago the idea of giving the building rate a decay proportionally with the distance between the building and the closest TC. I would add the castle too to this rule.
This way, towers could be buffed and back to shine as a proper defensive and making trush more difficult to do for the agressor, but more rewarding if you do it well.
The decay could start at 12 tiles and reach the max decay (lets say -30% in building rate) at 24 tiles.
So, full decay, a watch tower will take 104 secs to build.
Wheelbarrow and hand cart could upgraded these distances improving the no-decay area, and Treadmill Crane could reduce the decay to -15%
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Since you have given us your nick through your screenshot, i went ahead and watched a couple recs of yours.
What to say? I’ve seen you calling gg for others (you writing “gg?”), i’ve seen you ragequit without writing gg to someone else. For someone that made a post about how people should not bm that is quite hilarious.
Besides that, i suggest you start working on your macro and even on the build itself
4 Likes
So the person complainjng about peoples hate is in fact quite hateful themself?
I always call GG. The post game chat is not visible in recs. Dont judge by half information.
That gg? was because the other guy was wasting time. The opponent had no TC. I had a 60 vill lead and he was not quitting.
Don’t be quick to judge others.
It is still BM. You have no right to call the GG for the opponent, no matter what.
I’m willing to give the benefit of the doubt.
This does not change the rest of the discourse. You are a OTP that spams a cheese, no one should be forced to say gg after that and, generally speaking, you should work hard on both your build (which is quite bad) and on your macro (the amount of idle tc is incredible).
Also, I love that out of all of this
You replied only to the BM part
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why otp label? i am new to the game, and trying all strats one by one. Please dont assume and judge others. The hate is real.
I do not hate you 11
If someone opens your profile, download some recs and all he sees is tower rush with man at arms and a forward archery every single game, with the same civ and regardless of the map… well, that is literally the definition of one trick pony
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I think it’s just logical that devs now nerf that poles trush bonusses. They should just read what happened in this thread to come to the conclusion why it is the right call.
This thread should not be taken into consideratio for balance. The game i saw all happened between sub 1k elo people, those games are not determined by balance but by mistakes of the players.
The reason why Poles should be nerfed in (at least) one of thei eco bonus is that having both a food boost and gold out of stone at that ratio is too good
mmm what about Obuch, and szlachta priviliges?
Check F1re vs Dark in T90 Titans league:
Those are strong, but if you nerf their eco they are automatically harder to afford and to get to
What, range indicator?
You mean me? I fail to see any cheat style mod, care to elaborate?